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And try to trick the Open Firmware for Mac Os ROM to avoid the MacRisc3 closed door. For this we have to Hex Edit the ROM, change the NVRAM settings or in the last chance Reflash the firmware ¿?
interesting to see the inclusion of the "promise pdc20270"this is the same chipset off the original "fasttrack" ide raid pci cardswhich i was writing about suspecting them as the origin of the "mac bootable" seritek firmware after reading the hex code inside the firmware file
Mactron... I am so interested in the results of this thread.
Diehard was the CD-ROM an externally connected device? If so then a fresh install on the internal HD of the X-serve via FW400/800 has yet to be tested yet then?
Looks like a dead end getting OS9 running on these machines.
Yes... CPU will be going into MDD and Xserve will be parted out on eBay and scrapped after iMic and Mactron are satisfied
Has anyone tried with the original revision of the xserve G4? I have a original revision (Tray loading cd, Dual 1.0Ghz) Xserve G4, Would be interesting if it could run os9 (I'll try it myself at the weekend in no ones else has tried it)I'm not sure if there any differences between the first and second revision of xserve G4 though, so it might might not make any difference
Quote from: nanopico on May 05, 2016, 08:19:43 AMQuote from: MacTron on May 05, 2016, 08:08:02 AMQuote from: nanopico on May 05, 2016, 06:20:35 AMYeah Elliot and I are working together on this. I actually have this crazy idea now that we can probably get some level of booting on the mac mini and xserve g4's with some creative complicated manual open firmware adjustments. Still probably won't boot very far, but it's entirely possible.Booting the xServe with Mac Os 9 may be a great conquest. But while as it have very similar parts to a MDD, it have other very different components, wich can difficult the Mac Os 9 booting.Here we have an early draft of this project:http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,1964.msg10740.html#msg10740I like a challenge, even if it is unrealistic.... And I have a spare xServe Rev 1 lying around doing nothing. If I can get OS 9 working on it then I'll have an excuse to actually make use of it! I even have the substitute AGP riser available so I have more choice of video cards. I suppose, in the end, anything learned in success or failure on the 'less-realistic' machines will still go a long way towards achieving full function of the other machines we're much closer on.
Quote from: MacTron on May 05, 2016, 08:08:02 AMQuote from: nanopico on May 05, 2016, 06:20:35 AMYeah Elliot and I are working together on this. I actually have this crazy idea now that we can probably get some level of booting on the mac mini and xserve g4's with some creative complicated manual open firmware adjustments. Still probably won't boot very far, but it's entirely possible.Booting the xServe with Mac Os 9 may be a great conquest. But while as it have very similar parts to a MDD, it have other very different components, wich can difficult the Mac Os 9 booting.Here we have an early draft of this project:http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,1964.msg10740.html#msg10740I like a challenge, even if it is unrealistic.
Quote from: nanopico on May 05, 2016, 06:20:35 AMYeah Elliot and I are working together on this. I actually have this crazy idea now that we can probably get some level of booting on the mac mini and xserve g4's with some creative complicated manual open firmware adjustments. Still probably won't boot very far, but it's entirely possible.Booting the xServe with Mac Os 9 may be a great conquest. But while as it have very similar parts to a MDD, it have other very different components, wich can difficult the Mac Os 9 booting.Here we have an early draft of this project:http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,1964.msg10740.html#msg10740
Yeah Elliot and I are working together on this. I actually have this crazy idea now that we can probably get some level of booting on the mac mini and xserve g4's with some creative complicated manual open firmware adjustments. Still probably won't boot very far, but it's entirely possible.
found a cascading interrupt controller @ 0x00000000cascadeStack[1] = 58 (ua_size = 2)DEFAULT CATCH!, code=900 at %SRR0: 00208ca4 %SRR1: 00003030
I'm going to continue doing what I can to help the others with my Rev.1 xServe. I'm getting a lot of very interesting information back from Elliot already. While much of it is right over my head, I think I'm still of use, and I'm also brainstorming on various ways they can improve the entire process for everyone. Elliot seems to be quite excited by what I've logged on my xServe already. It's amusing seeing people happy about error codes. If nothing else, I've learned far more about the Mac booting process over the last two days than I ever did in all my years prior.
Just PM'd you, nano. I'll get you that output in the morning. I had a hard time questioning the ATA controller given that a number of third-party cards have used Promise chip variants. Even if it wasn't a perfect match for the driver it shouldn't be a stretch for it to work. I don't know if there is any firmware onboard the Promise hardware though that would need the right OS 9 hitches, as was typical of PCI expansion cards, or if it is all handled by the primary motherboard firmware. I would hazard a guess that even if it can't boot from either ATA-6 channel, it may still be able to communicate with the drives as storage only. The device tree appears to indicate that all the fancy drive monitoring functions are being handled by a completely separate chip also.
And then lightning strikes and my brain bursts open.I believe the thing preventing the xserve from booting is the external ata controller. Which is referred to as AppleKiwi.As the drives on that controller are set for the boot device, even booting from CD will cause those to be looked at and since there are no OS 9 drivers for this controller then it fails.The output from MacOS Plus shows that the initialization failure is on that controller's first disk.This gives some direction to look now. Because the overall architecture is the same as the MDD that support 9 and I believe that this AppleKiwi is the road block on this machine (and I could be wrong). Well at least the current one we are running into.Strike that note. I believe MacTron noted something about the PCI Bridge. This is probably 100% correct. Open Firmware will load the ROM and then the ROM will initialize stuff. The ATA controllers are inititalizing (based on MacOS Plus output) and then it fails. That would be the PCI Bridge. Because those don't initialize the Keylargo chip won't initialize. So the hurdle is the PCI Bridge's. So if MacOS Plus is willing to do a couple more things for us related to capturing some output from Open Firmware via telnet then that would be really awesome.
Correcting myself again. Looking over MacOS Plus pervious post, the pic bridges are not an issue. I looks like all the devices past it our initializing. Something with the secondary ATA controller is the issue, but what is the question.Has it been tried to just remove the four hard drives temporarily and try booting off the cd?It does like the controller is recognized fine, but moving down to the disks is not. Not sure if this will get us any further, but it might. Just a crazy idea.
Quote from: nanopico on May 20, 2016, 04:55:06 AMCorrecting myself again. Looking over MacOS Plus pervious post, the pic bridges are not an issue. I looks like all the devices past it our initializing. Something with the secondary ATA controller is the issue, but what is the question.Has it been tried to just remove the four hard drives temporarily and try booting off the cd?It does like the controller is recognized fine, but moving down to the disks is not. Not sure if this will get us any further, but it might. Just a crazy idea. Anything I've done so far while setting up and testing my xServe right now has been with no hard drives in the slots, not even any external devices except the keyboard. Perhaps it doesn't like having no drives? Still I'm not convinced, but stranger things have happened in Apple's 'alternate dimension'. Further to my previous observation, what really is the 'hitch' that a system needs to consider a physical device controller, or device itself, a valid target for a boot device in OS 9? I'm reminded of the absolutely maddening nonsense of the Apple-ROM'ed SCSI CD drives that were always needed to make booting automatic. Third parties wrote around this with an extension but you still needed to be booted to a desktop before you could select a CD as the next boot device on reboot in this scenario. I'm also reminded of the SeriTek SATA PCI cards which were flashable with an alternate firmware to make them valid. Everything seems to have to be 'just right' to play ball with Apple's environment choices. I have flashed video cards, SCSI cards, and also did the established hack required to make certain vendors PCI device IDs on Realtek-based ethernet cards work with the available extension. In an 'ocean' of possibility like this it might be hard to tell where any of our problems with the xServe truly sit, but it will be fun and educational trying. I'll be back in a few minutes with your requested output (the revised version).
Last login: Mon May 16 13:58:30 on ttys000Hyper-PowerBook-G4:~ administrator$ telnet 192.168.0.250Trying 192.168.0.250...Connected to 192.168.0.250.Escape character is '^]'. ok0 > printenv-------------- Partition: common -------- Signature: 0x70 ---------------little-endian? false falseOpen call - nvram already open ok0 > devaliaspci0 /pci@f0000000agp /pci@f0000000pci1 /pci@f2000000pci2 /pci@f4000000ui2c /uni-n/i2cui2c-serial /uni-n/i2c/cerealkeyboard /pseudo-hid/keyboardmouse /pseudo-hid/mousesound /pseudo-soundeject-key /pseudo-hid/eject-keynvram /nvramenet /pci@f4000000/ethernetfw /pci@f4000000/firewirebridge0 /pci@f2000000/@dpci /pci@f2000000/@dbridge /pci@f2000000/@dusb0 /pci@f2000000/@d/usb@8usb1 /pci@f2000000/@d/usb@9fwx /pci@f2000000/@d/firewireenetx /pci@f2000000/@d/ethernetmac-io /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7mpic /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/interrupt-controllerhd /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@15/ata-6@0/disk@0cd /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/ata-4@1f000/disk@0zip /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/ata-3@20000/disk@1ide0 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/ata-3@20000/disk@0ide1 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/ata-3@20000/disk@1ultra0 /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@15/ata-6@0/disk@0ultra1 /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@15/ata-6@1/disk@0scca /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/escc/ch-asccb /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/escc/ch-bki2c /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/i2cki2c-serial /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/i2c/cerealvia-pmu /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmurtc /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/rtcpi2c /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2cultra2 /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@1b/ata-6@0/disk@0ultra3 /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@1b/ata-6@1/disk@0bridge1 /pci@f2000000/@11lm87 /uni-n/i2c/lm87kgpio /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/gpiokeyswitch /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/gpio/@cmonitor /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/gpio/@12indicator /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/gpio/@15led /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/gpio/@209554-0 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2c/@1409554-1 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2c/@1429554-2 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2c/@1449554-3 /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2c/@1469554-M /pci@f2000000/@d/mac-io@7/via-pmu/pmu-i2c/@148last-boot /pci@f4000000/ethernet@fscreen /pci@f0000000/ATY,Rage128Ps@10 ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@15 .propertiesvendor-id Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@15/ata-6@0 .propertiesname ata-6Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@1b .propertiesvendor-id Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/AppleKiwi@1b/ata-6@0 .propertiesname ata-6Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/pci-bridge@d/mac-io@7/ata-4@1f000 .propertiesname ata-4Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/pci-bridge@d .propertiesvendor-id Open call - nvram already open ok0 > dev /pci@f2000000/pci-bridge@11 .propertiesvendor-id Open call - nvram already open ok0 >
One of the USB ports is physically destroyed.
QuoteOne of the USB ports is physically destroyed.Before powering up, remember that manged USB ports often create a hard short that will not allow the unit to post, so pick out all the broken metal pieces with small needle nose pliers and then you can fill the square hole will hot glue from a crafts gun, this stops any accidental use of a bad USB port that could short or damage the MB
You can now add the xserve to the list of bootable machines.
Holy sh*t! What do I have to do to try this when I get home tonight?!? We spent a while 'battling' the ATA controller - did you finally manage to fully disable that blasted "Kiwi"? Did you have to disable anything else? I can hardly wait to open up System Profiler on my machine to see how all the hardware reports itself.
" /pci@F2000000/AppleKiwi@15" find-package drop delete-node" /pci@F2000000/AppleKiwi@1b" find-package drop delete-nodeboot cd:,\\:tbxi
That's really interesting if you could boot from the internal optical drive over the ATA4 bus because that means my idea to put an SSD in a conversion carrier should work too. When I get them in the mail I'm going to try that, made easier by the fact I should be able to boot the CD from my external FW DVD drive.
I was so excited about trying this out I went straight to the machine after work. I booted the original version of the "Universal 9.2.2" disc from the external FW DVD drive. In an ironic twist (because of what I'd just been saying about ATI), when it got to the desktop it seemed to get hung up, but pressing "cmd-opt-esc" popped up a force-quit dialog for "ATI Video Accelerator". After quitting this it quickly finished loading to the desktop successfully!!!!!!! The Rage128 Pro AGP video card I'm using wasn't getting along with that one extension, but at least that is an entirely separate and isolated issue. I can sort that out later. I'm still getting proper video and full access to resolutions. The max for this card on VGA output is 1280x1024 at millions of colours. (It has 16MB VRAM.) Next I ran ASR to install to an external SSD on another firewire port. This ran quite smoothly. Rebooted to the SSD with extensions off - WORKED! Cleaned up extensions and control panels (pulled all the ATI ones for now), rebooted - WORKED!!!!!! IT'S ALIVE!!!!! Not only is this machine very fast, even without the video acceleration and a very old video card, but the multiprocessing is WORKING!!!!!!!! Built-in ethernet works, time server sync works, file sharing enabled (I will test this further later), and internet access WORKS!!! I managed to download Classilla 9.3.3 using Internet Explorer (obviously I could have just copied it from somewhere else, but that wasn't the point). Now that I have a usable and fast browser on this Xserve I thought it would be most appropriate that I post this message directly from the keyboard of this machine. History, folks! This is so AWESOME!!!!!!!!! I feel honored! This is a huge dream come true for me personally because I originally bought this machine years ago with the hope that some day this would actually work. I never thought that this long after the official dropping of OS 9 support I would be sitting here running this FOR REAL! I don't know what else to say - I'm ecstatic!!!!!!!!! I will continue testing to see if anything else doesn't work aside from the main ATA controller. This machine is so simple there isn't really much left that could go wrong. We'll continue to work at this and keep you all posted!P.S. Just before I settle down and go to bed I have one thing to add. I decided to swap out the AGP Rage128 Pro and AGP riser for a Radeon 7000 PCI 32MB and the PCI riser just to see how a later card would work. The Radeon plays nice with all the extensions, seems to have acceleration working, and gives me access to 16:9 ratio resolutions for the LCD I have connected. Now I have a crisp, native 1440x900 and better scolling. When I locate my Cinebench installer I will give it a run at benchmarking the performance.
CINEBENCH 2003 v1****************************************************Tester : MacOS PlusProcessor : Xserve G4 Rev.1MHz : 1.0GHz 2MB L2Number of CPUs : 2Operating System : Mac OS 9.2.2Graphics Card : Radeon 7000 PCI 32MBResolution : 1440x900Color Depth : Millions****************************************************Rendering (Single CPU): 94 CB-CPU Rendering (Multiple CPU): 177 CB-CPU Multiprocessor Speedup: 1.88Shading (CINEMA 4D) : 113 CB-GFX Shading (OpenGL Software Lighting) : 321 CB-GFX Shading (OpenGL Hardware Lighting) : 242 CB-GFX OpenGL Speedup: 2.84****************************************************
Imagine the included serial port works for MIDI data.
Magma Slot Peek ===============PCI Slot Name : $3x4 (Devices:device-tree:pci:pci-bridge:pci-bridge:pci-bridge) Card Name : pci-bridge Device Type : pci Board Version : 6 Board Vendor ID : 1011 Bus Slot Number: 4; on PCI Bus Number: 3PCI Slot Name : $4x7 (Devices:device-tree:pci:pci-bridge:pci-bridge:pci-bridge:ADPT,2940U2B) Card Name : ADPT,2940U2B Device Type : scsi-2 Board Model : ADPT,1757800-00 Board Version : 1 Board Vendor ID : 9005 Bus Slot Number: 7; on PCI Bus Number: 4
Software overview Serial number: XB2270GNLZF Mac OS overview Finder: 9.2 System: 9.2.2 US Active enabler: Mac OS ROM 10.2.1 (Generic) QuickTime: 6.0.3 CarbonLib: 1.6.1 File sharing: is on Multiple Users: Not installed Note: No startup disk was selected.Memory overview Disk cache: 8160K Virtual memory: is off Built-in memory: 1.50 GB Number of empty RAM slots: 1 (DIMM0/J21) Location Size Memory type DIMM1/J22 512 MB PC2600U-30330 DIMM2/J23 512 MB PC133 CL3 DIMM3/J20 512 MB PC133 CL3 Video memory: 32 MB Built-in display in use Backside L2 cache: 2 MBHardware overview Machine ID: 406 Model name: RackMac1 Keyboard type: Apple Pro Keyboard Processor info: PowerPC G4 Machine speed: 1000 MHz Processors: 2 Nanokernel version: 2.28 Nanokernel pool extends: 11 Nanokernel scheduled CPUs:2 uni-n: 36Network overviewEthernet built-in Link: up Speed: 1 Gbps Duplex: full Modem Name: Protocol: Version: Status: No Apple modem found.Open Transport Installed: Yes Active: Yes Version: 2.8.3AppleTalk Installed: Yes Active: Yes Version: 61 File sharing: is on Default AppleTalk zone: Not available Active network port(s): Ethernet built-in This network: 65280 This node: 128 Router: <not available> Hardware Address: 00.03.93.b5.e3.f2TCP/IP Installed: Yes Active: Yes Version: 2.8.3 Personal Web Sharing: is off USB Printer Sharing: Not installed Netmask: 255.255.255.0 IP address: 192.168.0.194 Default gateway address: 192.168.0.1 Domain: Name server address: 8.8.8.8Production information ROM revision: $77D.45F6 Boot ROM version: $0004.44f1 Mac OS ROM file version: 10.2.1 Serial number: XB2270GN-LZF-0000 Software bundle: Not applicable Sales order number: Not applicable
All of mine were sent to the scrapper, but the CPU boards live in my MDDs. If I get another one in I will test Cubase and some other DAWs.