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Author Topic: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)  (Read 127120 times)

ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #120 on: October 29, 2018, 01:16:55 AM »

darthnVader.  Wow thanks a mil man.  I only saw the forum post today.  I'll give these commands a try this evening when I'm home to see what happens and give feedback.  Just to correct my previous post, my G4 has the GF2MX not the 4. 

Currently there is an 80GB HDD installed.  The drive was partitioned to 2 40GB partitions, both are HFS but the partition reserved for OS 9 has journaling disabled.  When setting up the computer, I booted 10.4 Tiger retail DVD and used Disk utility to make the two partitions as well as made sure the 'Install disk drivers' option was selected.  Running 'info' on the drive shows this as correct when comparing to other screenshots I found online.

I have tried the following:
Restoring the IMG file from various MacOS9Lives discs to the OS 9 partition. 
Installed from 9.1 retail disc in classic mode as well as some 9.2.2's I could find.
Force bless on OS9 system folder. (These commands were confusing, including the next points.)
I found a forum posting on another website where I think the OF commands were to trick the OS into thinking I had a different CPU.
In some instances, the system would sit on flashing question mark and not boot anything but other times it would just go straight to X, do not pass go and do not collect $200.
In every instance, the system would not even attempt to boot OS 9 discs.  X would start when I finally stop holding the C key.
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #121 on: October 29, 2018, 03:29:07 AM »

darthnVader.  Wow thanks a mil man.  I only saw the forum post today.  I'll give these commands a try this evening when I'm home to see what happens and give feedback.  Just to correct my previous post, my G4 has the GF2MX not the 4. 

Currently there is an 80GB HDD installed.  The drive was partitioned to 2 40GB partitions, both are HFS but the partition reserved for OS 9 has journaling disabled.  When setting up the computer, I booted 10.4 Tiger retail DVD and used Disk utility to make the two partitions as well as made sure the 'Install disk drivers' option was selected.  Running 'info' on the drive shows this as correct when comparing to other screenshots I found online.

I have tried the following:
Restoring the IMG file from various MacOS9Lives discs to the OS 9 partition. 
Installed from 9.1 retail disc in classic mode as well as some 9.2.2's I could find.
Force bless on OS9 system folder. (These commands were confusing, including the next points.)
I found a forum posting on another website where I think the OF commands were to trick the OS into thinking I had a different CPU.
In some instances, the system would sit on flashing question mark and not boot anything but other times it would just go straight to X, do not pass go and do not collect $200.
In every instance, the system would not even attempt to boot OS 9 discs.  X would start when I finally stop holding the C key.

Code: [Select]
" /" select-dev
" PowerMac4,2" encode-string " MacRISC" encode-string encode+ " MacRISC2" encode-string encode+ " MacRISC3" encode-string encode+ " Power Macintosh" encode-string encode+ " compatible" property

Likely that is the code needed to boot your iMac, the CPU is known to OS 9, it's the same CPU used in the 800Mhz iMac that supports OS 9 booting.
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #122 on: October 29, 2018, 10:51:38 AM »

darthnVader... I don't know what species / humans bred you but man... YOU ARE BRILLIANT!!  I've googled more than I have in a looong time and couldn't find what you happen to know.  THANK YOU!  I booted OF the ran the commands in the post above at wham bam thank you ma'am, OS 9 on Option boot!  I am really and truly stoked and thankful for your help.  I havn't the time to see what does and / or doesn't work but will give feedback when I do this.  (December maybe)

If you find yourself in South Africa, look me up... you deserve a Bells.  But don't come here for just the Bells, you will get mugged sooner rather than later.
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #123 on: October 29, 2018, 11:43:39 AM »

All the time I had to test is up :(  Here is some feedback.
The command works and the OS 9 discs now boot to desktop.  The 3 discs I tried all give an error on install at the same point.  Something about cannot read audio cd player something something.  I didn't note it as no time... Only enough for 1 more test.
I booted X then restored the MacOS9Lives img to the OS 9 partition.
OS 9 not showing in Select Startup Disk. 
Reboot to OF and retype command then mac-boot with option pressed.  OS selector only sees X and 9 install cd.  I boot cd, open OS 9 partition and drag finder from System Folder and then drag it back.  All icons changed as expected.  OS 9 cd nor partition show on Option startup nor Startup Disk.

2 things.  I'm either missing a command to commit changes to pram or whatever.  OR the flat battery on the board is throwing a spanner in the works.  The closest I could find to a replacement fit is a 3v Energizer 123.  I have a few 3.6v cellphone batteries so I'll modify something to hook one up.  I have to get back to the second job now :(
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #124 on: October 29, 2018, 02:44:44 PM »

Do you have OS 9 and OS X on the same partition?

Only one System can be blessed at a time that way, I normally make two HFS+ partitions, one for OS 9, the other for OS X.
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #125 on: October 29, 2018, 03:07:44 PM »

One drive and 2 partitions.  Time gets reset when I unplug the cord so the dead battery may be causing it to lose sight of OS 9.  Just a guess though.
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #126 on: October 30, 2018, 02:36:54 AM »

Ok, no attempts to boot from hard drive have worked in any way.  The discs I have for 9 all boot but all fail with the same error at the same point.  Basically when it starts reading / copying files near the start I get an error that complains about cannot read audio cd player file and that I need to move it to another location and try again.  This even happens on 9.1 retail.
I have tried to bless the OS 9 folder by booting X to single user but this doesn't seem to have worked as the system still only sees X on startup.  It also does not see any of the OS 9 cd's until I type the command above again but as usual, this stop working the moment the computer reboots. (It only works if I mac-boot after typing the command.)
There are still a few things to try but not right now.  If any of you have suggestions to try, send them my way.  Once I get this system fully working on 9 I'll make a step by step howto for my model and give credit where due.
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #127 on: October 30, 2018, 04:27:01 AM »



Really, it's best to have OS 9 on it's own partition.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2018, 04:55:11 AM by darthnVader »
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #128 on: October 30, 2018, 05:35:05 AM »

OS 9 is and always has been on it's own partition.  1 drive to serve them all. two partitions to share the land.  OS X is and always has been installed on the first partition (HFS+ Journaled.) OS 9 has always only been on the second partition, including the Classic install.  This partition can be formatted, reloaded, converted, deleted all independently from the X partition.  There is no native OS 9 software on the X partition,  OS 9 partition is also configured to be ignored by Finder in X.

I have fore many years played with operating systems and am well aware of partition structures on the x86 river bank but PPC is new to me in every way.  Despite this, I still believed in setting the drive up as two completely independent partitions specifically to try get 9 going.  I'm not phased at all about keeping X on this iMac since the G5 runs the same OS much faster and more happily.  The G4 is a bit sluggish with Tiger.  The only reason X is still there at this point is because OS 9 installer seems to fail religiously on every medium I've tried.  The firewire install option cannot be tried because I don't own any nor know anyone that owns the correct wires.

USB booting may still be an option as the 10.5 installer I made for the G5 was visible as a boot option when plugged into the G4.  I can try set up a USB drive as a test for 9. 

My wife has given me permission to spend 2 hours on the iMac tonight.  What a lucky day :)
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #129 on: October 30, 2018, 10:19:05 AM »

Ok, made it to the desktop from the hard drive.  Not sure why yet but for some reason, it won't boot off the partition I prepared for 9.  One of my attempts to install 9 natively, I created a temp folder on the X drive and copied the contents of a 9.2.2 boot disc there. Booting back into 9 CD then running the setup from that temp folder gets me no further than any other setup as it stops with the exact same error.

On a subsequent test, I boot into X by accident after typing the OF commands.  While in X, I opened startup disk and it shows available boot volumes, namely Tiger, OS 9 CD and the temp folder on the X partition but not the one on the partition configured for 9?? Anyway, I then deleted the contents of the temp folder then copied the OS 9 partition files to the partition which is home to X.  Back in Startup folder I now see the OS9 on X volume and select that to bless the folder. After reboot, it shows the blue disc with smiley and question mark as expected.  A quick reboot to OF, run the required commands then mac-boot and voiala! OS9 welcome :)

Now to figure out how to boot without having to type a lengthy command in OF every time I restart.
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #130 on: October 31, 2018, 01:16:45 AM »

Ok, replaced the battery with a home made 3.6v battery but I still have to type the commands every time I restart.

On the plus side, I have shortened the commands to:
" /" select-dev
" PowerMac4,2" encode-string " MacRISC" encode-string encode+ " compatible" property

A quick question, the ROMS posted on page 1 of this thread, are they supposed to bypass me having to type this commands in every time or is the PRAM battery supposed to assist in 'remembering' what I typed above after a restart?
« Last Edit: October 31, 2018, 02:31:05 AM by ZenecadE »
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #131 on: October 31, 2018, 05:06:02 AM »

Ok, replaced the battery with a home made 3.6v battery but I still have to type the commands every time I restart.

On the plus side, I have shortened the commands to:
" /" select-dev
" PowerMac4,2" encode-string " MacRISC" encode-string encode+ " compatible" property

A quick question, the ROMS posted on page 1 of this thread, are they supposed to bypass me having to type this commands in every time or is the PRAM battery supposed to assist in 'remembering' what I typed above after a restart?

There is an nvramrc script you can edit and use from the terminal in OS X. The nvram is flash based storage in the boot rom, so it doesn't require the pram battery, just be careful, changes can leave your Mac unbootable, with no way to clear the nvram.

 
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ZenecadE

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #132 on: November 01, 2018, 12:42:18 AM »

Firstly, I would like to thank MacTron for starting this thread, darthnVader for putting me on the right track and SnakeCoils for providing the ROM.  Without these friendly chaps, I would still be struggling.

It looks like all is working to the level that I wanted.  Here is my hardware.  iLamp iMac 4,2 G4 800MHz manufactured June 2003.  15" flat panel, Geforce 2MX 32MB, USB1, listed as X only.  I replaced the faulty DVD ROM drive and replaced the PRAM battery with a home made setup until I can source the correct cell locally.

Ok, here are the steps I followed for my system.

Boot from Tiger retail DVD
In Disk Utility, erase internal hard drive to 2 partitions and make sure install OS 9 Drivers is checked. (WARNING! This step erases all content on internal hard disk.)
Install Tiger to one of the partitions.
Boot into Tiger and mount the IMG file as found on the MacOS9Lives 2013 disc.  Drag and drop the contents of the mounted IMG to the second partition.  (At this point, OS9 did not appear under Startup Disk.
Restart Mac and boot to Open Firmware (Cmd + Opt + O + F)
Type the following in order:
" /" select-dev
" PowerMac4,2" encode-string " MacRISC" encode-string encode+ " MacRISC2" encode-string encode+ " MacRISC3" encode-string encode+ " Power Macintosh" encode-string encode+ " compatible" property
mac-boot
Let Tiger boot
Head on to page 1 of this thread and look for the ROM posted by SnakeCoils.  Download and extract that to Tiger desktop.
Drag the ROM file to the "System Folder" for the OS9 you dragged to the second partition above.  (Overwrite the existing file.)
Now, provided you booted with the commands above, you should see the OS9 install in Startup Disk.
From this point onward, my system now correctly boots to OS 9 without me having to type the above commands every time. 

A note though.  If I boot back into Tiger without the commands listed above, I don't get OS9 under startup disk.  However, if we don't boot into Tiger, the commands are no longer required.

Guys, thanks again for all your help.  darthnVader, I still owe you a Bells for the initial help.
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac Os 9 boot on unsupported iMac G4 (Flat-panel)
« Reply #133 on: January 29, 2019, 01:51:41 PM »

Quote
Though I need to be a little careful of that so I don't render the card useless.

Diehard has about 4 or 5 of those laying around so hack away :)

Good to know.  I've just been a little careful after bricking two iBook motherboards poking around at the firmware.

PWR+AppleKey.
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kcufosx

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #134 on: June 15, 2019, 07:43:44 PM »

Want some feedback.

I have an iMac G4 USB 2.0 1GHz 15 inch system.

Using this install media: http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2143.0.html

Mac OS 9 installs just fine. However, sometimes I get stuck at 256 colors and I can't figure out why. I've managed to revert it back to "Millions of colors" only to get stuck with 256 again at the moment.

256 might be acceptable for the games I want to play but Marathon seems to want to run with bizzaro colors when like that and not run at all at millions of colors -- this is something else I don't understand.

The only real wrinkle here is that I'm using an IDE to SD card adapter instead of a hard disk with an SD extension cable to make this externally accessable. I then have a 128gb sd card for OS X and a 64gb SD card for OS 9.

Could booting to OS X be causing me to trip something to disable the graphics driver? If so how can I work around this (preferably permanently)?

Really appreciate any insight and I'm so glad there is a community that still runs OS 9, it's such a cool OS.
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Alexbt

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #135 on: March 05, 2021, 07:12:01 PM »

Hi all. My friend is trying to install the "Previously Unsupported version on a "Powermac6,1" revision (1ghz, 64 GeForce4).
It boots the disc, he sees the splash screen, but is presented with the dialog box: "This startup disk will not work on this Macintosh model. Use the latest Installer to update this disk for this model.

I'm unclear if there are still issues or OpenFirmware hackery that must be done, or if perhaps something got changed in the image and broke compatibility? There are no model specific notes on the download page for any of the iMac G4's.
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Greystash

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #136 on: April 04, 2022, 11:26:06 PM »

Has there been any further developments on the GeForce4 MX support? I just acquired a iMac G4 1.0 15" and have everything running, but it's strange that the GPU isn't recognised since it was supported in the 800Mhz 17" version that could natively boot OS9.
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darthnVader

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #137 on: April 06, 2022, 09:00:57 AM »

The 4 MX in the 1Ghz model iMac G4 is NV18, those iMac's that supported OS 9 were NV17.

I did some work to try and patch the nVidia drivers, but all efforts to bring support for NV18 to OS 9 failed and I sold that iMac quite awhile back.
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DieHard

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #138 on: April 06, 2022, 09:37:28 AM »

The 4 MX in the 1Ghz model iMac G4 is NV18, those iMac's that supported OS 9 were NV17.

I did some work to try and patch the nVidia drivers, but all efforts to bring support for NV18 to OS 9 failed and I sold that iMac quite awhile back.

Darth, we thank you for your efforts :)  and for trying to get a solution for these later models.

You have helped so many people, more than you will ever know, that are enjoying retro gaming on mac minis and other machines from you accomplishments.

Thanks for the clarification; units that "appear" to be almost identical are obviously very different when it comes to chipset changes and software drivers.
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Greystash

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Re: Mac OS 9 booting on: iMac G4 Flat-panel (Detailed Posts)
« Reply #139 on: April 07, 2022, 01:29:04 AM »

Thanks Darth, I've been modifying properties in Open Firmware and trying a few other things but haven't had any luck either. As DieHard said - thank you, you have been invaluable with these modifications. I am still using my PBG4 with the modified ATI driver + Mac OS ROM combo you put together!  8)
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