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[supernova777]

***UPDATE***
i've updated the chart of graphics cards + sorted the chart by different columns for comparison
http://www.macos9lives.com/downloads/_img/gfx/graphicsChart_byCoreClock.PNG
http://www.macos9lives.com/downloads/_img/gfx/graphicsCardsChart_byGBs.PNG
http://www.macos9lives.com/downloads/_img/gfx/graphicsChart_byReleaseDate.PNG
purple coded card names are the stronger more capable cards
***UPDATE***
plz note: the pci-e entries are just for comparison + reference purposes

what im personally looking for is, the most compatible card for different uses/operating systems
offering as decent modern performance as possible!

this is a bunch of reference information for reusing + repurposing graphic cards (by flashing from mac to pc or from pc to mac)
from working REAL MAC powerpc computers to INTEL/AMD hackintosh's running OSX leopard or snow leopard
or vice versa! so again my personal reasons for looking for a geforce card and not a radeon card
is the hackintosh compatibility factor!!! radeons work fine in real powerpc macs but not in hackintoshes!
well actually this is not entirely true but the distro states the geforces are better supported "out of the box"


please note this is a rough outline of available info from distro publications + other info sources
guaranteed some cards will work that are not shown to work (with green box) on this graph

My effort was to try to find a card that supported both mac os 9 + os x (both ppc + intel hackintosh osx)  with at least moderatre performance for both (preferably leaning to performance side obviously hehe) but also to acquaint myself with the cards + when they were released + what performance they offer + which gpu chip powers them etc
having learned this now i think im in a better position to possibly even look at overclocking or at last having a perspective on which chip can be overclocked safely
(f.e. taking a mx/xt/lite card + adding a better cooling + changing the rom to a higher one)


chart

download: http://www.macos9lives.com/downloads/_img/gfx/graphicsChart_byCoreClock.PNG

list of graphics cards
http://www.gpureview.com/videocards.php?sort_by=chip_name&sort_type=asc

ppc os9
http://www.jcsenterprises.com/Japamacs_Page/Blog/8923D90A-7AD8-41F1-BD1A-FEA5E1780B95.html

ppc osx
http://www.jcsenterprises.com/Japamacs_Page/Blog/4B4B7BA2-7ABB-47F1-87AC-B03D37942BEE.html

hackintosh 10.5.7 intel requirements
http://iatkos.me/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=23024

hackintosh 10.6.3 intel requirements
http://iatkos.me/forum/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=23023

not sure if u can tell by my chart but the geforce 6xxx series agp cards seem to be compatible + reusable from hackintosh to powerpc..
and will function in os9 aswell.. but not 100% correctly or "Accellerated"
these cards are 10 years old from 2004-2005 and can be found in classified ads for about 5$-20$ used most likely!

a great buy looks like the x800 SE if it supports os9?

UPDATE: http://www.gpureview.com/nvidia-nv41-chip-71.html
from this page on gpureview i found it very usefull to use this topright hand corner Dropdown box "Choose A GPU:" which lets u quickly browse different GPU chips..
and then it lists which cards are produced from that chip.. its a really great way to see the steppings of the graphic cards to browse in this manner!

[Protools5LEGuy]

AGP card in a hack? I did twice on tiger 10.4.11 with Jas XXX rev2 with P4 2.8Ghz and nvFX5200 256 and atiX1600.
On my followings hacks 10.6.8  I went PentiumD/Core2 pci express GMA950, nv6600, nv7300LE and GT220.
The Ati X1600 was not seen on PowerPC
I am thinking in flashing my fx5200 256 mg to powerpc

[supernova777]

i just flashed my oem mac geforce2 mx card that was originally inside a quicksilver G4 to work in a windows 98 pc
but no matter what i do i cant get this card to display 1680x1050 on windows 98SE
(update) i was able to fix this by editing the .INF for the driver and adding manually the resolution modes!!!! its working PERFECT now + faster at lcd native res! awesome!

i have discovered this version of protools 5 that lets me use 32 tracks with ****any audio interface**** i want to use
(out of the many interfaces that would be macos/win98 compatible at least, see http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=282.0)
but of course this hack works only on windows 98SE operating system only

[supernova777]

does anyone know if a geforce 6200 AGP will work in mac os 9? (with or without accelleration?)


one of the last agp cards to still be sold in my area

if it worked properly it should be around the same speed similtar to a geforce4 ti4600
or between that and a radeon 8500 at least... i guess i will soon find out as im getting one for $5 from classified ads;)

UPDATE: got the card.. for $5.. along with a gigabit ethernet realtek card for another $5.. big spender;)
i look forward to testing to see if i can get it to work with a powermac g4, and aswell to see if i can make it work in win98se 
i have read about problems getting any 6 series geforce cards to work in win98 because nvidia stopped making the drivers
to support these cards and focused only on xp/2k from that point on..
(win98 is totally the os9 of windows versions .. shunned+ abandoned! LOL at least it was never publicly humiliated + given a funeral hehe)

confirmed that this card works in the agp2x only ancient slot 1 motherboard... so it is totally 2x AGP compatible which means it definately will be agp 4x compatible aswell so the box really should say 8x / 4x / 2x agp

[supernova777]

for those who want the best AGP card speeds possible.. for mac os x.
its really a fight between these two:

7600 GT
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:21HWAUMrEMoJ:www.gpureview.com/geforce-7600-gt-agp-card-435.html+&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

7800 GS
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:caQQbfaJbIcJ:www.gpureview.com/geforce-7800-gs-agp-card-382.html+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca






they have the highest specs
i wonder if they would even support mac os 9 (unaccellerated or not!)
i hope to find out

i was thinking of hunting down one of these for my 10.5.8 hackintosh / win98 box im in the process of making...
but ive just realized a problem.. there is no win98se driver for the Geforce 7xxx series cards!!!! lol
http://forum.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=204357
^^ apparently someone says in this thread that they have made it work by hacking the .inf driver texts so its possible
but they never bothered to create a driver for these cards (being made in 2007, win98se from 1999 was obviously ancient history to them)
so it seems that i may have to be satisfied with a series 6xxx card to be able to dual boot from 10.5.8 leopard hackintosh to win98se
like i have planned for this machine:D made from 2006 parts (some of the last to support win98se) (also this motherboard fits into a powermac g4 case! which was the original reason i bcame interested in it at all! its physical size and that it has 3 pci slots similar to a sawtooth but of course, intel core 2 duo powered!)

motheboard: asus p5pe-vm
http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P5PEVM/

cpu: intel core 2 duo E4300
http://ark.intel.com/products/28024/Intel-Core2-Duo-Processor-E4300-2M-Cache-1_80-GHz-800-MHz-FSB

[supernova777]

AGP card in a hack? I did twice on tiger 10.4.11 with Jas XXX rev2 with P4 2.8Ghz and nvFX5200 256 and atiX1600.
On my followings hacks 10.6.8  I went PentiumD/Core2 pci express GMA950, nv6600, nv7300LE and GT220.
The Ati X1600 was not seen on PowerPC
I am thinking in flashing my fx5200 256 mg to powerpc

how did the 10.4.x on intel do performance wise?
ive never gotten the 10.4.x ones to work...!
probably because i didnt have the right video card

[Protools5LEGuy]

how did the 10.4.x on intel do performance wise?
ive never gotten the 10.4.x ones to work...!
probably because i didnt have the right video card

Tiger was great, but I only had Logic 8 as a DAW. A friend with a Dual G5 2.2 told me my Pentium D 920 with GMA 950 was fastest than his setup using Logic and the User Interface too. But I preffered at the time the flexibility of Protools LE 6.1.1/MP 7.3/7.4 on Xp, than Logic 8. The pentium 4 was slower but comparable to a G4 single was faster. Core2Duo was the "G6" .
Protools 8 HD XVX make me try Leo on P4, but 10.6.8 is where Protools 8-9 runs better

[supernova777]

Tiger was great, but I only had Logic 8 as a DAW. A friend with a Dual G5 2.2 told me my Pentium D 920 with GMA 950 was fastest than his setup using Logic and the User Interface too.

I believe it!!!

But I preffered at the time the flexibility of Protools LE 6.1.1/MP 7.3/7.4 on Xp, than Logic 8.

flexibility for what? rewire? or do u mean RTAS over AU plugins?

The pentium 4 was slower but comparable to a G4 single was faster. Core2Duo was the "G6" .
Protools 8 HD XVX make me try Leo on P4, but 10.6.8 is where Protools 8-9 runs better

ah! G6 lol  umean the "g5 killer"

[Protools5LEGuy]

I just moved from Logic 3.6 ProISIS(PentiumII) to Logic 5.5.1(terratec dmx6fire24/96 on athlom 1.4) on PC to Protools on OS9/XP (2 AMIII on G3 and P4)
Given the number of RTAS I had for OS9/G3 350 vs XP/P4 2.8 I used Protools6.1.1/logic5.5 on XP lots of times, having the g3 for those days the P4 did not wanted to run...(15-20% of days)
I decided to abandon Logic5.5.1 on PC for not having later upgrades on PC focusing on Protools. Bought an audiophile 24/96 for protools mp just when Apple decided go to Intel, Digidesign to abandom 001/AMIII and M-Audio to go M-Powered (PT 6.7-6.9).
Later I recieved a DIGI 001 (2008) and went Protools 5.1/6.4 for multitracking/mixing on P4 win98/Xp. I made my first triple boot Win98 with logic 3.6 proISIS/protools5.1; Xp Logic5/protools6.4 and Tiger XXX rev2 Logic 8
Recieved a Pentium D and I left Isis/001 on Pentium4 and M-Audio for xp and Pt 7.4 with dual booting tiger and logic 8.
Just re-focused on PT 7.4 on XP was my main platform 2008-2010.
On 2008 I recieved a G4 466 DA and give a chance to osx protools, coming back to OS9 for the lack of plugs in OSX I had at the time and the OSX half power versus full powered OS9 optimizations.
On 2009 I recieved a Logic Xskey w 5,6 and 7, waking up my first use of DAW on 1999-2000 with Logic from a "totally converted" Logic user who had to go protools as a daily DAW for arrangements, mixes and mastering as all studio in area works mainly on PT.
His loss, my gain.
I can use Logic and Protools for midi, but for OS9 Logic is my first choice on midi works. From protools 8 midi is easier to handle.   

[supernova777]

[supernova777]

just to reiterate a quote from the man, japamac himself frm this page:
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2028986?tstart=0

I use a flashed Geforce 6800 GT in a Quicksilver, which supports OS 9 graphics fine, and is a great performance card in OS X.

Whether boot in OS 9, or run in Classic (most common) I have excellent 2D/3D performance with the 9800 Pro and the Geforce 6800.

Either will function just fine in OS 9, and either will provide Core Image support for Tiger and Leopard.

There isn't a need to spend a lot more for the 256MB version, though.
Testing shows the cards to be equal, with the 128MB version actually being slightly faster in certain applications.

. OS 9 will function fine, however, there isn't 3D acceleration support with either card in OS 9. Really, the same can be said for all cards that were released after OS X was released.
This is not a problem for most users, and would only affect games played in OS 9, not Classic. I have never encountered a problem in OS 9 (or Classic) with the Radeon 9800.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/1820130?tstart=0

im only concerned about *2D* accelleration in os9.. not *3D* and everything i read about these 8500/9000/Geforce 4 cards that are supposedly "accellerated" for mac os 9..
has to do with *3D*... im not wanting to play quake on os9;) i just want great video updating.. high mhz refresh etc . mostly for all the audio apps we discuss here on this site!
but being able to have performance "in the bag" for booting the same machine to osx someday.. is a bird in the hand + worth two in the bush hehe

im using a geforce 4mx card in my agp sawtooth and the performance is pretty good.. im starting to think *ANY*geforce4 card (MX vs TI etc) works great for mac os 9..
if u compare the specs from the geforce 4mx card its pretty much close to the radeon 8500 or radeon 9000.. all of them operate at 275Mhz
which is leaps + bounds above the original rage128 which is clocked around 140mhz

"Not all cards may be used in MDD models. The geforce 6200 and all Geforce 6800 models are INCOMPATIBLE with the MDD" --japamac

i wonder what the reason for this would be? ***DOES THIS MEAN THAT THE 6600 GT IS 100% ok with the MDD?***

[supernova777]

The GeForce FX 5200 can be used on a Mac running OS 9, but with no acceleration and with limited resolution settings.

http://lowendmac.com/video/agp/geforce-5200.html

i wonder how bad this can really be?? given that the fx5200 has higher spec then all the other os9 cards..
and if the fx 5200 aGP works.. then what about the fx 5500 aGp? or the fx 5950 ultra agp?
perhaps they too can allow basic "no acceleration, limited res" functionality in os9

[supernova777]

More than 10 available *NEW*
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-AGP-Nvidia-Geforce-7600GT-512MB-7600-GT-Video-Graphic-Card-/281219105035?pt=PCC_Video_TV_Cards&hash=item4179f7010b

Hello, you are watching a New AGP Nvidia Geforce 7600GT 512MB GDDR2 128BIT video card!

Hard to find AGP model!!!

BUY it now for $49.98 only!

tempted to buy one of these to see if it works;)
if they can get a 7800 GS working.. i bet this would work.. 2006 technology..
would be a perfect match for my Asus P5PE-VM but the icing on the cake would be
if it were to be powermac g4 or g5 compatibile ASWELL!


http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/midlow_range_gpus.html

Specifications:

    GPU: 7600GT
    Memory: 512MB GDDR2
    Bus Interface: AGP 4X / 8X
    Bus Width: 128 bit
    GPU Clock: 400Mhz, Memory Clock: 532Mhz
    Output: DVI, VGA, TV-out

even if this one is only 400mhz clock..
made in july 2006.. vs 2004.. no contest?
i think the performance of this would be close to that of a GT210 gpu

[supernova777]

apparently the 2006 white imacs had a BTO option of the same 7600 GT geforce graphics!
http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/specs/imac-core-2-duo-2.16-24-inch-specs.html

Video Card:    
GeForce 7300GT    
VRAM Type: GDDR3
Details:
NVIDIA GeForce 7300GT default graphics processor with 128 MB of GDDR3 SDRAM using PCI Express
-or-
GeForce 7600GT with 256 MB of GDDR3 SDRAM also available at the time of purchase for an additional US$125.

[supernova777]

XFX Geforce 7800 GS (the radeon 9800 killer )


wonder how loud the fan is.....
and if it works with an ati silencer cooler

[supernova777]

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/Graphics/Radeon_9700PRO_OEM/




some info on what japamac says is the only OEM apple card that ever supported core image

[supernova777]

re: 6200 + 6800 not being compatible with mdd:
http://themacelite.wikidot.com/xfx-6200-agp

•Currently the most popular video card for the G4 Cube and one of the most modern video cards available for it. Cubes are limited by the 2x AGP slot and PSU power so this is as far as we have been able to go. (The 6600 series did not work)

•Caution: This card is known to not work properly in the G4 Mirror Door (MDD) Mac.

anothr reference to this fact on this page ^^^ this is an agp card of course
but im curious if its that SPECIFIC manufacturers version of the card rather then the entire geforce 6xxx series that would be incompatible with an mdd..

i would have to buy
http://www.ebay.com/itm/256MB-VIDEO-CARD-GEFORCE-6200-DDR2-PCI-VCG62256PPB-/360857500745?pt=PCC_Video_TV_Cards&hash=item5404c87c49
one of these to test the theory.. is it worth 20$ to me?? hmm

Chipset Manufacturer: NVIDIA
GPU: GeForce 6200
Core Clock: 350MHz
PixelPipelines: 4
Memory
Effective Memory Clock: 533MHz (effective)
Memory Size: 256MB
DirectX 9
OpenGL 2.0
RAMDAC
400 MHz
Max Resolution
2048 x 1536@85Hz
Cooler
Fanless
Operating Systems Supported
Microsoft Windows 98, ME, 2000, XP, or Vista

if only the one i found for 5$ near me was pci instead of agp i could test;)
why do i care? well 533mhz is a helluva lot faster clock then 300mhz! regardless of connection type pci/agp

[supernova777]

http://www.s155158671.websitehome.co.uk/x850xtcoolerinam.html
x850 installed in an mdd at the expense of 2 ram slots

[supernova777]

http://lowendmac.com/video/agp/geforce-6200.html

just found this page.. stating that a geforce 6200 can work for booting into mac os 9..
its talking about a 128/256mb version the card i just nabbed is a 512mb so it may not have any joy trying to make it work with a powermac g4.. but i got it because its also compatible with the hackintosh builds referenced above... and i can use it on my Asus P5PE-VM 2006 mobo which as ive said before i plan to use either for win98se (Because of its compatibility with that os) and also as a 10.5.8 intel leopard box to fully explore the cusp of ppc/intel compatibility... !

The GeForce 6200 can be used on a Mac running OS 9, but with no acceleration and with limited resolution settings.

could this card realy be a card that will work in all scenarios with semi-decent performance?
> mac os 9
> mac os x
> hackintosh intel
and also:
> win 98SE/ME
> Windows 7 32/64bit
> Windows Vista 32/64bit
> Windows XP 32/64bit

heres the actual card i got:
http://www.evga.com/Products/Product.aspx?pn=512-A8-N403-LR
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:8b3h2mb9OhEJ:www.gpureview.com/geforce-6200-agp-card-192.html+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=firefox-a

[supernova777]

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/sightings,432.html

heres an article on variants of the geforce 4 ti 4600 pc cards (most of which can probably be flashed)


the green lines are comparable to a geforce ti4600..
this bench, altho conducted on a pc using xp shows the speed difference from a 7500 or 8500 radeon
the geforce 2mx would obv be less then the gefroce 4mx -- so u can see this card is 2-3 times more powerful
then those oem mac cards that came with the mdd + quicksilver

this benchark chart reflects what mactron said about these nv25 powered card being noticably faster for using os9