Author Topic: Guide to Create a Portable External FireWire Drive for Mac OS 9 w/ Partitioning  (Read 26600 times)

Offline DieHard

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External FireWire Drive for Mac OS 9 Project
A few details that you may (or may not) know

I will focusing this post on smaller Notebook-sized, hard drive enclosures.  Desktop drive-based FW enclosures also work, but they are bulky and require external power.  Portable drive cases can be powered off the FW bus without the need for a power pack.

Portable FW drives are very convenient for traveling and storing and work just as good as full-sized desktop enclosures. As many of you know, FW drives can be used as Backup solution, extra storage solution, and even as an emergency boot device.  You can make an exact copy of Mac's your internal boot partition by cloning it, using the apple ASR software, or simple dragging the files to a partition to the external FW drive (if you have no copy protected programs); this can boot you mac with all the contents in the event of an internal drive failure.

OK, so it's been a while since I did a step by step post. 

Some of these details are spread around a bit, but I wanted to consolidate the info. and make a "How to" guide and also explain a few things that may NOT be so obvious...

Why Make an External FireWire Drive, when I can just buy one off ebay ?

Well, I am glad you asked...

1- If you buy a large FireWire drive (200GB+) and plug it into your make mac, you will realize that you can only format it as one large partition using the "Apple Drive Setup" Utility.  So, if you plan to open the external case, put the hard drive internally  into your mac (to partition it) and re-install it into the case, good luck; Many pre-made external FW drives by Lacie and iOmega are almost impossible to open and extract the Notebook drive (there are clips, not screws) that will get damaged and you will most likely get very frustrated and gouge your perfect drive casing to hell with a flat-head screw driver.

2- A "used" ebay hard drive, may not be that reliable to begin with, and running diagnostics on the actual hard drive will be challenging in it's case

3-  A 3rd party tool, like HDST, will indeed partition the FW drive into as many equal size partitions as you want, but it replaces the standard HD drivers upon formatting and the volumes may or may not mount if you connect it to another mac that does not have HDST installed on it.  In general, I shy away from 3rd party utilities since I want my drives to be readable (without errors or glitches) from any mac, so I like to stick with the Apple Tools that have less room error.

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Can I build my own External FireWire Drive, so avoid all these issues ?

Yes, dumb-ass, that is why I am making this post...

1-  Start with a good case.  So many OWC cases are the top of the food chain.
One important note is that OWC releases different versions of their cases and does NOT change the names, make sure you are buying a case with FW400 or FW800 ports, the other ports do not matter.  Be carefull not to buy a case with USB only as OS 9 can only operate at USB 1.0 and you be very sorry !
Almost all have the oxford FW chipset (the best). They look awesome.  And you can get any standard brand new Notebook SATA drive or SSD to go in without a hassle.  Also you can even get the "Mini Dual" as I have mentioned in the past, that supports 2 Notebook SATA drives and has Hardware RAID 1 (to mirror your data) built into the case !

OWC Mercury On-The-Go Portable 2.5" FW800/USB3.0 Enclosure Kit for Serial Sata
Damn, a real beauty. Not cheap, but who cares; this is the one you want, even if you have to save your lunch money.

The best choice for a single drive case winner

OWC Mercury On-The-Go Portable 2.5" FW800/USB3.0 Enclosure Kit for Serial Sata
You can configure the RAID as RAID 1 (Mirror, protect data) or RAID 0, (Stripped, gain speed, if either drive fails, you loose)

The best choice for a Dual RAID case winner

2- Use cool quiet SSDs or large 5400 RPM Notebook drives.  Do NOT use hot 7200 RPM drives in external cases, you are at the bottle-neck of FW anyway, so why heat things up in cases.  Most desktop drive FW cases have fans, notebook drive cases do not.  Some of today's 5400 Notebook drives have lots of cache and run at read/write at lightning speeds. A 1TB mechanical drive will cost around $50.  A great choice is the Seagate 1TB BarraCuda 5400 RPM 128MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 2.5" Laptop Internal Hard Drive ST1000LM048.  Sells at New egg for $49.99
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822179108&ignorebbr=1

Seagate 1TB BarraCuda 5400 RPM with 128MB Cache !

Of course an SSD is the best option in the performance arena... but the mechanical is the best bang for the buck :)

3- NOTE: this step is OPTIONAL: As Mactron mentions below...
Quote
Apple Drive Setup 1.9.2 can format (and make all the partitions you want) most HD's inside firewire enclosures.

If it's easy for you, get a PATA to SATA adapter and partition the drive inside your mac:




Keep all partitions to 190GB or less if possible on large mechanic drives (so you can defrag them later), if you will be using it as extra storage and you will be doing Audio/Video editing directly to the FW drive.  SSD obviously, read/writes to the entire drive at the same speed, so NEVER defragment SSD partitions/drives.  If it is a backup drive only, perhaps make one 190GB or less so that you can boot to it via FW if you copy Mac OS 9 to it and make all the other partitions any size you want, but research and be aware of Mac OS 9 file limitations as far as file name character length, total path length, number of files, etc.  Also, the number of volumes that will mount on the desktop.  Remember, a 1 TB or 2 TB (1000GB to 2000 GB) drive would have been hard to fathom back in the classic Mac OS days... so I would avoid making partitions larger that 500GB in any case... but that's just my opinion.  Also remember, if you want to re-partition later with Apple Drive Setup, you have to pull the drive from the case, and all data goes bye-bye.

I now call upon my core members to add information about what FW portable cases they have tried that work excellent under Mac OS 9


« Last Edit: February 14, 2022, 10:21:14 AM by DieHard »

Offline Bob_D

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Hoi, i have a few Lacie Quadra cases (FW400/800, usb2 & sata) with 2TB drives and an older FW/usb case (500 GB pata/ide hd build in). On my QS867 booted in os tiger or leopard I can partition (apple partition + 0s9 drivers) the FW-drives and they are bootable under OS9 if partitions are small enough. Oddly it seems you'll have to make ten partitions (189Gb each) on the 2TB drives to get them small enough. At first sight I couldn't make one small (sliding in drive setup stops at 250 something) and a few larger (+500GB) partitions on the 2TB drives.
So if you have a dual boot machine this looks to be the easy way ...

Offline DieHard

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As discussed many times... I personally (with much outside debate) do NOT recommend using the same FW drive for both OS X and OS 9, OSX with eventually cause errors... like the infamous "Btree 0,0" Header error and long file name issues...
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=2830.0

What makes you think apple cared about file integrity for OS9 after OS X came out ?  Have you read about all the blunders in the new APFS... history repeates at apple, they only look forward

Basically, even mounting OS 9 Drives with spotlight on will eventually write things to the OS9 drive/partition that Mac OS 9 will not understand and flag as issues when running "disk first aid" and other utilities in OS9.  So, I still stand by this statement.  Some run "Dual-Boot" for years and never have an issue... some end up with all sorts of file issues... I prefer, Dual macs (1 OS X and 1 OS 9) over dual boot and my OS9 FW never "touches" an OSX machine; but that's just me... Mr. Paranoid :)

macStuff

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the btree error is the most aggravating error
but its usually easy to recover from by just copying the data to another drive + formatting the drive and then copying the files back again, but its a huge pain in the ass that CAN be sidestepped + prevented if you heed the advice

another great fix if you really must have the osx drive in the same machine is to disable the osx drive mounting in os9's drive setup

i think the same is possible to prevent the os9 drive from being mounted in osx aswell https://www.cnet.com/how-to/prevent-a-partition-from-mounting-in-os-x/ https://discussions.apple.com/docs/DOC-7942
we should make a graphic tutorial because the options are kind of buried in submenus
« Last Edit: January 25, 2018, 08:35:45 PM by macStuff »

Offline DieHard

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the btree error is the most aggravating error
but its usually easy to recover from by just copying the data to another drive + formatting the drive and then copying the files back again, but its a huge pain in the ass that CAN be sidestepped + prevented if you heed the advice

Yes, 100% agree, I think the post I mentioned also says that. Just copy files off and re-partiton/reformat drive with issues and copy files back

another great fix if you really must have the osx drive in the same machine is to disable the osx drive mounting in os9's drive setup

i think the same is possible to prevent the os9 drive from being mounted in osx aswell https://www.cnet.com/how-to/prevent-a-partition-from-mounting-in-os-x/ https://discussions.apple.com/docs/DOC-7942
we should make a graphic tutorial because the options are kind of buried in submenus

Yes also disable "Spotlight" in OS X as mentioned in other posts, or just keep OS 9 stuff away from X to avoid too much thought :)

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well if the drive isnt mounted at all... pretty sure that means its not accessed! even for indexing

Offline DieHard

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well if the drive isnt mounted at all... pretty sure that means its not accessed! even for indexing

Good Point... just figured I would give a little extra info. :)

Offline MacTron

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3- Get a USB to SATA and partition the drive inside your mac:


Just a side note: Apple Drive Setup 1.9.2 can format (and make all the partitions you want) most HD's inside firewire enclosures.
Attached Apple Drive Setup 1.9.2 in case someone need it.
Please don't PM about things that are not private.

Offline DieHard

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3- Get a USB to SATA and partition the drive inside your mac:


Just a side note: Apple Drive Setup 1.9.2 can format (and make all the partitions you want) most HD's inside firewire enclosures.
Attached Apple Drive Setup 1.9.2 in case someone need it.

Well that kinda changes... LOL, so they removed ability that is Drive Setup V2.1 ?   I really did NOT remember that v1.9.2 can do it... I thought I used HDST or FWB before Mac OS 9.2.2.  So, just to clarify...  You can have the latest FW extensions, a 9.2.2 System, and simply run the older drive setup version :)   Any issues with doing it this way ?

Offline MacTron

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Well that kinda changes... LOL, so they removed ability that is Drive Setup V2.1 ?
Probably ...
Quote
So, just to clarify...  You can have the latest FW extensions, a 9.2.2 System, and simply run the older drive setup version :)
That's it.  :)
Quote
  Any issues with doing it this way ?
No, AFAIK.  :)
Please don't PM about things that are not private.

Offline dr bu

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so today i bought an 2.5 wd green 120gb ssd to put in a usb2 FW400 enclosure -Tas120!? that ive been sitting on for like three years.
for some reason drives in this enclosure with blessed systems looking obidient when pressing alt at startup much to my greif always refused to boot. i had access to files but never solved this problem.
well today just for the kick i asked drive setup 1.9.2 to single partion and transfered a regular systemfolder.
im here to report booting worked most charmfully!
djupsinnig

Offline DieHard

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As usual... M.A.R.L. gets it done :)

Offline Bob_D

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Think it's a good idea to keep os 9 and osx apart. But would partitioning under Tiger/Leopard and then using the FW only in os9 still be problematic?

Online IIO

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But would partitioning under Tiger/Leopard and then using the FW only in os9 still be problematic?

that would be the most straight forward way how to do it - given that you have OSX available on the machine.

i have partitioned all my firewire drives using OSX 10.4.11, both IDE and SATA 300 and i would almost claim that they work better in OS9 than in OSX :)
« Last Edit: April 01, 2018, 01:30:07 PM by IIO »
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Offline billyboy

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Hey guys... glad to be back here. My name is billyboy, and I can see this place has exploded since 2012! Die hard, I have a question. Can  u tell me what brand ssd FIREWIRE hard drive to use to run cubase 5.2.2 on a G4 933 quicksilver desktop. Can I put a couple of them inside or are they external?  Also where do I get the drive and what is the adapter I need. I am fairly coherent in working on these old horses, but it has been a while since I have worked on my music. Here is my delimma: I have tons of songs that  I am about to start mixing, and I need something that is stable to back them up. Also, the reason I am going with ssd technology is that I have had trouble in the past with defragging these older type drives (too full)? And before u ask... I did make sure that all partitions were under 190 GB. IT WOULD FREEZE HALF WAY THROUGH THE DEFRAG! My computer is full to the brim and I do not want to lose 25 some odd years of hellish work that I have put into this stuff! Honestly, I am overwhelmed by it all. Are these ssd drives more stable? Are there glitches? I sure do like not having to defrag! There is something plain scary about wondering if all this work will just go up in a puff of old tech smoke! Anyhow... thanks... in advance for the help.

 By the way... I have all of it backed up on three drives, and another external drive. I use a mac with OS X as a front end keyboard patch generator and mastering unit for the back end (T-Racks 3 mastering suite), but i will not let my OSX computer anywhere near the OS 9 files! I also like to know if you guys know of some other effects processors that can now be used within Cubase 5.1 that are worth a damn... Once  again... thanks in advance, guys. Billyboy
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 11:03:03 PM by billyboy »

Offline billyboy

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Sorry... I accidentally posted... I am mainly wanting some kind of front end UAD type of front end preamp /compressor software. I don't care about graphics, only that it sound good. Thinking about using the logic program in my OS X computer as a front end preamp compressor. I believe less is more, but I like having the tools when they are needed! Are effects processors that are in the DAW download  pretty good  - it has been years since I have  used some of them? This is the only thing i dont like about cubase 9.2.2... the compressor o board channel plugs are not real good, and there are no software channel plugs for preamps. Maybe the bad graphics are messing with my head. Heh heh heh...

However before I do anything I need to get these SSD hard drives set up and get that FIRST problem out of the way! BB
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 10:41:30 PM by billyboy »

Online IIO

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i am not sure if you are in the right thread... but i can confirm that you need either a powercore or a UAD to have a simple "amp" type of plug-in. really sad ;)

regarding disks, via the firewire interface there should not be a limit what SSD works or not, same as with HDs.

using SSDs under OS9 via IDE or SATA is tricky though, many modern models wont work.

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Offline billyboy

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Hey buddy... thanks for the help. I would gladly go to the right thread.

Hey, I read here last night until the wee hours, and unfortunately, it seems that after my 5 year break from recording (or should I say, my brake from being a 24/7 computer tech with cubase), one thing is clear... there is no backup strategy that is perfect under 0S 9.2.2, WHEN RUNNING CUBASE!

 Frigging old techknowledgy sucks! Bring on the ceramic glass indestructible drives... please.

I thought about going to pro tools in OS X, but it will probably be more of the same crap! Plus, I would have an immense, time consuming new software learning curve, as well as a lot of money spending. And aren't these glued together new macs just the bomb! Lol! What a world...Not to mention the fact that if i did go to OS X, i probably couldn't get my dozens of songs to open in pro tools without having to physically align the tracks and set up all the effects and automation manually! All I ever wanted was to be a musician and songwriter (grew up listening to Beatles, Stones, cat stevens and Zeppelin), not a computer tech, engineer, jack of all trades.

Oh well... tis life...

I figured that after taking a five year break from recording, u guys would have everything ironed out on using the vintage OS 9 stuff! Lol!

Can anyone tell me what to do? This stuff will drive u crazy!

By the way... I am confused... do the ssd drives run with sata AND firewire? Sorry about my ignorance. I have the sonnet tempo serial Ata card which provides 2 ports for my 2 sata drives. this makes the sata drives work - sometimes, along with the 2 red cheesy adapter cords. My current 2 internal drives use this, but half the time one of them does't show the drive icons when I boot up, hence I have to reboot for them to show up. It is hit and miss...Do I just plug in the new ssd drives to the card, or do i hook them to firewire?

Also, where can I get the UAD Card. Are they still in business, and it it any good as far as far as preamps and compression? I bet it burns up all the cpu, huh? Thanks guys. Billyboy
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 10:28:51 AM by billyboy »

Online IIO

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not sure what you mean with backup strategies for a certain program. it was not required for OS9, but if you make sure that your project files are together in one folder with the audio files, you can make a backup of your projects by copying that folder to another physical disk.

CPU... no, using such a DSP card mainly aims at saving CPU power, by moving the plug-ins processing on the card.
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Offline billyboy

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Hey diehard,

I bought a 1 TB OWC NOTEBOOK SSD FIREWIRE drive today, along with the fancy clear case, and am ready to partition the thing, and install the OS 9 operating system in my G4 933 kHz mac, but I am confused as to which cables I am going to hook to in my computer, and which adapter I need. I have a sonnet DUAL SATA CARD installed in the PCI SLOT and I have 2 drives running off of the card, and another 3 drives being powered by the stock IDE cables that came with the computer. Where exactly do I plug this drive in? I bought the case you recommended, but I cannot figure out which cable to hook it too, and therefore, I am not sure which Adapter I need either. Do I even need an adapter? My sonnet card has two SATA drives, with SATA cables hooked to it. bb