OS 9.2.2/OS X HD flashing "?" + QS 933 + Digi 002 confusion and nonsense!

[Front 424]

Finally!
Some progress.. Figured out it WAS indeed the 6-9 pin adapter the cable came with.  Got around to testing that cable/adapter combo with a firewire hd (had to "borrow" someone else's) and it was not connecting to the computer  Bought a new bonified 6-6 cable and it is now recognized. 

Funny, but that adapter looked a little suspicious.  INSIGNIA brand, nothing wrong with that I don't reckon, but I had this nagging suspicion roaming around in my mind that there was something physically defective about it.  And I went through all that trouble to rule out and quell all software issues, only for some stupid little adapter to be the issue.

[geforceg4]

[Philgood]

You have a PM Front424.

[Front 424]

Thanks to all who have given input here.   I appreciate at least the support, though i eventually just had to figure things out by trial and error. 
It seemed like everything went to hell very quickly, and I got frustrated and had to take a break from it, and then a different approach.  Though it still seems almost ironic that my main problem was a faulty adapter, and half the s*** i dealt with initially had nothing to do with that!

Picked up a nice macally firewire enclosure and it appears to be working fine.  I will hopefully be using that for a good backup and transfer drive.  Everything seems to be suddenly alright!

EXCEPT...
That warning i got in both os x and 9 about the 002 faders not responding: everything on the console seems to get its proper response in the PT editor, but faders don't react.    In fact, the alert that PT in OS 9 gave me suggested the unit needed to be serviced, possibly!  I wouldn't think it might have something to do with incompatible firmware, would it?  I got that message from the program as well..

[Front 424]

And by faders I do mean the volume sliders.. panning and such works fine.  Really have only the had the thing up and running for a day now, and not much time to check everything.

I wouldn't think it might have something to do with incompatible firmware, would it?  I got that message from the program as well..

devil's_advisor didn't seem to have any issues with ignoring the firmware update, though maybe this is the other way around?

" 002's firmware was v1.21 while the system's was 1.20"

[Front 424]

New developments and dilemmas involving the fader issue.


I just found out that there is a separate firmware for the faders.  Checked the fader firmware and I got a value of "x.xx" returned.  I figured that might be an issue. 
Got some fader update from http://archive.digidesign.com/download/002/   

After waiting several minutes for it to update the 002 (regressing from 1.21 to 1.05) the faders' firmware still registers as X.XX.

Does this mean it's broken?  It should read numbers...
And it works same as before, but still no volume fader action, which is the most useful and basic.
 

[devils_advisor]

most likley damaged. maybe the previous owner did something to it. there is a third party company who used to work on 002's and improved them. maybe they can help you. let me find the name

[Front 424]

Cool!  I take all the help i can get.  Thank goodness i didn't spend what it used to cost back in the day, then again, it would probably be fully functional if I had. 

As far as previous owner, I'm guessing the seller was not the previous owner, judging by the amount of sales the person had on ebay.  I know people resell things they've gotten from others.  Haven't contacted them yet, not even sure I care to at this point, although after all the mostly phantom obstacles, this one seems to be a physical defect, and i'm not convinced that it was fully tested before it shipped.

[Front 424]

Have new question regarding a dual boot startup disk, similar to my initial calamities.

I had finally got OS 9 fresh install, which I detailed a few posts back, and also had installed a fresh osX 10.3.8 or 9 or whatever.  And for a while I was able to boot into either of them using the OPT key at startup to select the OS, but now it only gives me the OS 9 boot.  OS X is nowhere to be found, even though I can physically find the system on the disk.

Kind of like my initial problems after tinkering around it wouldn't boot into either system.  Fresh install worked good, could boot into either, but now it doesn't recognize the OSX install I just found out.  Any suggestions as to why that would be?? 

Even weirder is that I had the PTLE version in the OSX boot for the 002, and even in OS9 all the ProTools sessions want to load with the OSX 6.x.x version!

So it has given the OSX PTLE precedence, even though it is in OS9, and will no longer even boot into OSX.  Have no idea how that happened.  Confused!

[Front 424]

To summarise:

Had both OS 9 and X on same HD and could select either for boot.  Somewhere along the way only OS 9 is now recognized at boot selection, but all the OSX folders are still on that same drive. 

I installed the OSX 10.3.x after the OS 9 from an install found at macintoshgarden.org I believe.  It is burned onto CD.  Had no problem initially selecting either for startup.  I don't recall doing anything drastic to it since then..

[mrhappy]

Around here having OS9 and OS X on the same drive is not recommended as it usually leads to problems. There are many threads regarding this. Perhaps the commingling of operating systems is rearing its ugly head!! Better to use a separate drive for each and also take some precautionary steps so that OS x doesn't write data that is unrecognizable to Os9.

Search around and you should find lots of info.

[Front 424]

Around here having OS9 and OS X on the same drive is not recommended as it usually leads to problems. There are many threads regarding this. Perhaps the commingling of operating systems is rearing its ugly head!! Better to use a separate drive for each and also take some precautionary steps so that OS x doesn't write data that is unrecognizable to Os9.

Search around and you should find lots of info.

Thanks for the advisory!  I saw your response a few days ago, wasn't sure what to write at the time since it wasn't entirely urgent, but I apologize for my somewhat routinely late responses.  It all depends on how pressing the matter is... I think I have some type of rating system I use, I'm just unsure exactly how it goes! (procrastination is definitely the key)

I did originally have OS 9 and X on separate drives until I ran into whatever those dilemmas were that prompted this thread initially, where I couldn't get nearly anything to boot right.  I think you're right when you say

Perhaps the commingling of operating systems is rearing its ugly head!!

It's strange because I was able to switch back and forth for a while, and then that stopped working.  I guess it is a mystery.  Like my initial problems as detailed early in this topic. 
I would like to know more about the separation of 9  and 10, as you say there are many topics started on it.  My one issue that usually makes me pause before searching a forum, is that I seem to get a lot of irrelevant returns depending on topic and forum.  I don't know, maybe I got burned a few times with a bad search engine?

I did delete the OS X ProTools app, and all the sessions instantly wanted to open with the OS 9 version, so at least that's taken care of!  I should just delete everything else OSX related on there.

I'm hoping to get a working PCI SATA card and a SSD soon.  Was kinda weighing the options for a bit.

[GaryN]

This seems like a big deal, but it's really a simple issue.

I can say this because I've been running dual-boot Macs for over 20 years and I encountered and solved this a long time ago. It keeps rearing it's ugly head because it's not documented anywhere.

OSX and OS9 do not coexist peacefully on the same drive volume (remember volume - it's important) except for OS9 Classic, which is not bootable but just runs in a sandbox under OSX.
This is because they have similar but different directory files and when put on the same volume, they're not actually "aware" of each other.
Sooner or later under this setup (usually sooner) one or the other will write or delete something that the other one needs and you get what you now have.

This is easy to prevent.

1. In OSX disk utility, format a drive (yes, you gotta erase everything) making sure to check the box that says "Install OS9 Drivers"
2. Still in disk utility, partition the HD into two (or more if you like but at least two) volumes - one for each system.
3. Install OSX onto one partition using the OSX installer routine on the CD/DVD.
4. You can now install OS9 on the other volume in a few different ways, depending on what form you have OS9 in. You can:
   A. Reboot from an OS9 install CD and install 9 into the other volume.
   B. If your CD has the OS9 files expanded and available, you can just boot OSX and use it to drag copy the OS9 files from the CD.
5. If you only have OS9 as a disk image, use method B.
6. If you have more than one HDD in the machine, you can also put them on separate drives if you like since they're also different volumes.

However:

If the OSX version you have includes Spotlight and/or Time Machine you MUST immediately:
Go to the OSX system prefs for those apps and follow the instructions to prevent them from indexing, backing up or otherwise caring about your OS9 installation. Lock them out of OS9 - period. Otherwise, they will very quickly write stuff on the OS9 side that will cause problems in OS9, since it will be unreadable gobbledegook to OS9. Then, you'll get an ongoing war between the OS9 disk utility and the OSX utility and everything will soon go to shit.

This is what causes everybody to freak out and say you can't have the two systems on the same machine which is patently ridiculous.

That's it… finito, you're done. Enjoy your dual-booting Mac.

[Front 424]

Thanks for the reply GaryN..

When I reformatted the drive to install OS 9 after all my previous troubles, I had it in the back of my mind that maybe I should do 2 partitions, but I wasn't all that concerned because I wasn't thinking I was even going to be putting OS X back anytime soon, especially on that drive.
Guess I wasn't completely aware of the potential troubles, and they certainly didn't appear right away.  However, I had read some of the discussions involving all that on this site before.  I didn't properly heed the advisements, apparently!

1. In OSX disk utility, format a drive (yes, you gotta erase everything) making sure to check the box that says "Install OS9 Drivers"
2. Still in disk utility, partition the HD into two (or more if you like but at least two) volumes - one for each system.
3. Install OSX onto one partition using the OSX installer routine on the CD/DVD.
4. You can now install OS9 on the other volume in a few different ways, depending on what form you have OS9 in. You can:
   A. Reboot from an OS9 install CD and install 9 into the other volume.
   B. If your CD has the OS9 files expanded and available, you can just boot OSX and use it to drag copy the OS9 files from the CD.
5. If you only have OS9 as a disk image, use method B.
6. If you have more than one HDD in the machine, you can also put them on separate drives if you like since they're also different volumes.

However:

If the OSX version you have includes Spotlight and/or Time Machine you MUST immediately:
Go to the OSX system prefs for those apps and follow the instructions to prevent them from indexing, backing up or otherwise caring about your OS9 installation. Lock them out of OS9 - period. Otherwise, they will very quickly write stuff on the OS9 side that will cause problems in OS9, since it will be unreadable gobbledegook to OS9. Then, you'll get an ongoing war between the OS9 disk utility and the OSX utility and everything will soon go to shit.

Clean and concise!  Supernova had a sticky post along these lines, but your instructions are a bit more simple and to the point.  Maybe a revised sticky/pinned post would be helpful, like the simplified instructions placed at the top of http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,305.0.html?PHPSESSID=bafc0fd5552d3c834e467045a65335f2


Just a thought on that.

[mrhappy]

...and now I know how to spell 'gobbledegook'!!!