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Author Topic: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?  (Read 38973 times)

supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #40 on: August 19, 2014, 03:27:27 PM »

if u are lucky u can find the 6880m for the same price as the 6280m
i bought mine, like i said, for about 19$ (shipping included from taiwan)
but if hardware raid under os 9 is not interesting to you
then its easier to go with 6280m they are more easy to find now
a few months ago there were lots of 6880m's for sale
now, it seems to be only 6280m (naturally people would elect
to get teh more featured card for the same price)
this is whats happened .. the (second hand) 6880m cards are selling out first

diehard,
out of curiousity where can i read more about this AV optimizer?
(ie: where is the source of this info?) was it in the manual?
i gues it was just mentioned briefly on the barefeats site?

another pt from this barefeats site:
Quote
An alert reader found a SIIG ATA-133 RAID card at Fry's Electronics. It's an Acard 6880M ATA-133 RAID card in disguise


honestly i think there is alot of these ata133 dual port pci 32bit cards that will work for both mac + pc
even if they arent documented as such... i think that if u were to find one on the cheap (im talkin les then 10$)
u might be surprised that it actually works fine.. and when i say that i mean mac os 7-8 bootable too
again, this is just a guess.. but a well-read educated guess;)
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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #41 on: August 19, 2014, 03:35:25 PM »

I haven't read any reports of the SIIG card working (and booting an OS) in a 9600 but it's only $12. I may try it since it's cheap.

Now I'm just concerned about audio dropouts. I read that even iTunes does it.

if u are talking about the siig sata.. then im 90% sure it will not boot mac os.
hence all the into i posted into my "bootable pci" thread and the big deal about specific versions that did work
because most did not.. but if u have 12$ to waste and want to explore this.. go ahead
im sure we would all be excited to find a new source of sata pci cheap cards that boot mac
but this is the whole reaosn why the other mac booting cards sold for 69$+ in contrast to the pc ones that did not
they upped the price by 50$ for the mac crowd because they could;) supply + demand! capitalism at its finest

the ATA controllers for IDE drives.. like i just stated in the last post..
u could have sucess with... i would bet money.. u have at least a 50/50 chance ti will work.. lets say.. (liek the pic of this card i just posted in the last post,
the article diehard posted says this is the exact replica of the acard card) im sayn i think alot of these ata100/ata133 cards will be compatible with pretty much
anything.. another brand name coming to mind was that Promise Fasttrack 100 TX2 or fasttrack 66
but this has all been discussed in other threads

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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #42 on: August 20, 2014, 05:10:56 AM »

I read this same thing about the Sonnet Tempo SATA card. I wonder if that was fixed.

in conjunction with what apps should that happen? i mean, data is data, why would "dropouts" happen for certain file types only?

it is mostly matter of the way how a program reads the files, i.e. if the buffer is big enough. to bring quicktime player or cubase in the situation that data runs out a harddisk would have to fail at reading and sending data for like a quarter of a second ...
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Syntho

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #43 on: August 20, 2014, 01:38:40 PM »

No I hear that audio drops out no matter what you're doing in any software that uses audio.

SIIG JU-2NE012



I'm wondering if this thing would work well. I read somewhere that it would but all the SIIG cards seem to be made more for Windows machines.
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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #44 on: August 20, 2014, 01:53:14 PM »

if u want a usb/fw combo.. id stick with sonnet
not sure if they do a fw/usb/lan combo card
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MacTron

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #45 on: August 20, 2014, 02:18:52 PM »

I'm wondering if this thing would work well. I read somewhere that it would but all the SIIG cards seem to be made more for Windows machines.
Only a very few models of Silicon Image equipped cards will work on Mac Os 9 ( 3112 I think) and even more:
- They need to be flashed on a MS DOS PC.
- The working voltage of the card must be changed.
- Probably ROM chip must be changed also.
- And Mac OS 9 ROM file edited.

so...
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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #46 on: August 20, 2014, 02:34:01 PM »

wow, so many issues at once. maybe he should invest $15 instead of $12 and get a mac card?  8)
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MacTron

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #47 on: August 20, 2014, 03:26:36 PM »

wow, so many issues at once. maybe he should invest $15 instead of $12 and get a mac card?  8)

15$?
without seller life threatened?

WOW!
Cheaper than my green dog !  -afro-

LOL
« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 03:41:34 PM by MacTron »
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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #48 on: August 20, 2014, 05:03:10 PM »

I'm wondering if this thing would work well. I read somewhere that it would but all the SIIG cards seem to be made more for Windows machines.
Only a very few models of Silicon Image equipped cards will work on Mac Os 9 ( 3112 I think) and even more:
- They need to be flashed on a MS DOS PC.
- The working voltage of the card must be changed.
- Probably ROM chip must be changed also.
- And Mac OS 9 ROM file edited.

so...

doing all of the above will give u the equivelent of a sonnet tempo pci
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/tempo_serial_ata.html

which is basically a seritek 1s2 http://www.firmtek.com/seritek/seritek-1s2/
that is painted purple

this is why i suggested the acard 6880m because u can put 4 drives on that card
these two cards.. only two drives

the other possibility would be to get a seritek card that supports port multiplier
(so u can have 4-5 drives housed in a external enclosure connected externally via ESATA cable to a seritek pci card /w esata port)
but i think that isnt possible with a pre-g3 powerpc mac 600 series cpu machine..
i think for port multiplier support it must be g3/g4+ using OSX


just get the damn 6280m or 6880m and use IDE drives
if u want to put an ssd, get one of the DOM modules that knez suggested and connect to the acard card




compare the sonnet - firmtek cards - they are the same thing
« Last Edit: August 20, 2014, 06:51:38 PM by chrisNova777 »
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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2014, 05:48:20 PM »

 
well maybe not.
 
the second hand prices for "mac edition" stuff are usually even more overpriced than when new.

 
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Syntho

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #50 on: August 21, 2014, 06:37:04 PM »

I'm going to wait on getting the Sonnet SATA card. If there are audio dropouts, I'll just use the internal SCSI drive. That'll save me a PCI slot anyway.
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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #51 on: August 21, 2014, 08:07:19 PM »

i would seriously abandon all concerns about "Audio dropouts" honestly
harddrives have come along way since that time period..
these types of errors were more related to the actual drives ability to function moreso
then the ATA/SATA

hard drives from 2005 2006+ were alot different then hard drives from 2002 2003
ALOT better and now we have SSD which goes even further
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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #52 on: August 21, 2014, 09:42:45 PM »

I'm going to wait on getting the Sonnet SATA card. If there are audio dropouts, I'll just use the internal SCSI drive. That'll save me a PCI slot anyway.

good idea. :) the 2xSATA150 card is a nice product. one should simply test if any problems appear when streaming lots of data from disk. the price of 80 euros is paid back as soon as you connect only one 1TB harddrive, because 2 500 gb IDE HDs already cost 120 euro more.

in opposite to the internal scsi controller of a 9600, which is limited to something like 10 - 12 mb/sec, you will never come close the maximum a SATA disk has with such a computer.

one second of 24/44 audio is 0.129 mb long ... SATA150 will allow you to read more than 1000 tracks ... there is no software for MacOS 8 which allows that ... not talking of the speed and size of RAM you have in a 604e machine, which will end long before you reach 500 tracks.


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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #53 on: August 21, 2014, 09:45:08 PM »

...
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Syntho

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #54 on: August 21, 2014, 09:48:51 PM »

I read these posts about dropouts from both pre-2002 and 2012 or so. The only thing that will bother me is the additional HD noise and the loading time.
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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #55 on: August 21, 2014, 09:49:00 PM »

I'll just use the internal SCSI drive. That'll save me a PCI slot anyway.

yeah.. not so much.. this isnt really going to be an option,
as 110 has pointed out, this SCSI is an ancient form of scsi that is nowhere near what it needs
to be for what u are going to want to do with it.

u wont regret getting the sonnet sata card, when u see the performance difference between it
with ANY sata2 or sata3 hard drive made in the last 8 years let alone an ssd, its kind of worth
giving up a slot for.


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supernova777

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #56 on: August 21, 2014, 09:53:02 PM »

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/feedback/audio_stops_with_SATA_card.html

was this one of the threads u read? im googling now trying to find "pci sata audio dropout"

because if u read it, it says the guy solved the problem, and this was with an OWC Sata card..
i think they mention the seritek card tho (which is the same card as the sonnet as i mentioned previously!)

To be honest
i know diehard has mentioned this many times
and i know he based this on problems he experienced..
but from the research ive done, the whole 'pci bus saturation' stuff is more of a myth
because the pci bus can handle alot more data then that.. as mactron demonstrated with his
experiment using the seritek 1v4 width 2 ssd in raid formation to acheive a speed higher then 133mb/s
the pci bus can handle alot more then whats being thrown at it in =any= pci based computer... so this whole pci saturation explanation for audio dropouts doesnt cut it for me
we should know how easy it is for buggyness to occurr (with mac os 9 IN GENERAL I mean) and based on the amount fo times ive seen other people be incorrect about the cause of a problem
and myself personally.. its easy to make a mistake and think u know what the problem is.. or to make an assumption and even easier still to be totally incorrect
about that assumption.

theres no fuckin way simply having your hard drive connected to a pci card doing everyday bullshit clicking around is gonna cause dropouts
look at my post i just made about data rate of recording.. and compare it to teh bandwidth provided by these cards too.
its not even needing 25% of what it can do..
and remember knez comment about easily taking care of all his tracking needs with a 7200 IDE drive on the built in ata bus of a g4 (which is ata-66)
the real reason u get a performance boost using the sata drive is the actual drive u are using afterwards
and like mactron pointed out on knez post about DOM module.. the *access* time of the device is where the huge gain is.

the g4s already have ata-66 .. when u use ata-66 with a wickid good performing hard drive. = great performance!
but the old 600 series powerpcs.. they have like ata-33 + shitty internal scsi.. its more worth it on those machines
+ kind of neccessary to bypass the ata-33 or internal scsi or wahtever it has that is SOOO dated

did u already buy this thing? or are u just talking conceptually?? are u going thru with this? cpu upgrade to g3/g4?
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 10:12:30 PM by chrisNova777 »
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Syntho

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #57 on: August 21, 2014, 10:04:42 PM »

That's one of them. I read elsewhere that there's firmware/software for slowing the card down which gets rid of dropouts. I'm unsure where that software is available.
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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #58 on: August 21, 2014, 10:19:57 PM »

modern HDs do not make any noise. the first thing one should do on any mac lower than G5 is removing the HDs and donating them to a museum. a 13 years old IBM deskstar is about as loud as a G4 PU fan and so hot  that oyu cant touch it. a 6 years old maxtors noise is hardly noticable and it feels warm. with current SATA drives you will not be able to tell if it spins or not.
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IIO

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Re: How compatible is OS9 stuff with OS8.6?
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2014, 10:21:44 PM »

i think i will actually test that over the weekend, if it is possible to get drop outs from SATA disks in OS9. until now i am using my IDE disks for audio.
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