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[supernova777]

When shipped, these models were configured with MacOS X 10.2.3 pre-installed and neither can boot into earlier versions of the MacOS. Each can run MacOS 9 applications within the "Classic Environment" provided by MacOS X 10.4.11 and earlier, however.

cloaked alien: i think it migth be worthwhile to find the imac g4 restore cds that have 10.2.3 on them..  and then try the mac os rom trick again.

[Cloaked Alien]

cloaked alien: i think it migth be worthwhile to find the imac g4 restore cds that have 10.2.3 on them..  and then try the mac os rom trick again.

I'm not 100% sure but I'm fairly sure we already tried that, look at my earlier posts.

Edit: It's the Mac OS ROM from OS 9 that's the file you mod. It's version should not be confused with the OS version. Where should we find that on the OS X cd? ^^

I THINK I hunted down the restore CD from the supported G4 iLamp and had the OS 9 rom modified.

[supernova777]

Edit: It's the Mac OS ROM from OS 9 that's the file you mod. It's version should not be confused with the OS version. Where should we find that on the OS X cd? ^^

I THINK I hunted down the restore CD from the supported G4 iLamp and had the OS 9 rom modified.

originally i was talking about modifying the machines firmware..(via openfirmware) becuase this is the method that was used to have the success with the g4 mdd fw800 that we all witnessed on this board..... but now im talking about your approach.. the mac os rom mod approach.. my thoughts being that there could be "machine specific" versions of the 'mac os rom' that more properly support hardware differences.... some have explained that u cant use an older rom with a newer computer, because support for that hardware couldnt possibly be included.. well perhaps this is true, but also that they made different specific versions of the same rom version
 ie: maybe there was mac os rom 10.2.1 for ibook, mac os rom 10.2.1 for imac, mac os rom 10.2.1 for mdd all appearing as "10.2.1" "mac os rom" file but in fact having slight differences in the code inside??? we dont know for sure.. so what im suggesting is. TRY THE HACK WITH THE ROM ON THE RESTORE DISCS FOR THAT SPECIFIC MAC

the 'mac os rom' file would still have to be on the 2003 imac g4 restore discs to support the classic environment.... but to get it out of the disc u would *HAVE* to do a system restore i think.. or you could find the ".img" restore hard drive image on the disk and click to mount it in osx and find the mac os rom file inside somewhere...this is in contrast to the 2002 restore imac g4 discs that would have a system folder with the rom sitting 'out in the open' on the bootable system folder of the actual restore disc.. (as well as inside the hd restore.img file)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macintosh_Toolbox
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_World_ROM

VS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firmware

VS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Firmware

3 different things

[supernova777]

i have just now opened the imac g4 2002 restore cds and confirmed that its mac os rom version is : 9.1.1
dated april 8th 2002

lol i see your post above: http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=1173.msg4626#msg4626

so u tried this version? but which imac g4 do u have??
>>> 1GHz 17" model.
because if its a 2003.. that might explain the problems.. u used the 2002 rom on 2003 machine.. with different hardware..
as i showed above there was essentially 2 different motherboard types for these... 2003 x only macs have different hareware cloaked allen is obv aware of this as he pointed out above that they are different hardware..
but yes. back to my suggestion

i suggest finding the mac os rom for the imac 2003s restore disc.
i dont know the version of this file


this is what it looks like if this page is correct

we need to find this restore that has X 10.2.3 + os 9 (classic support)
specifically we only need this orange "restore" cd in the middle
actually the install should have the same rom on it aswell
but i mean to say one copy is enuff we dont need all cds
"we" meaning one of us, anyone of us..

but this page also lists 10.2.7 + 10.3 imac restore discs


http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2191?viewlocale=en_EN


SO according to this chart the orange disc 10.2.3 restore discs is for the 1ghz 17" that u have cloaked alien
whether or not this cd contains version of mac os rom vital to best performance of your hardware
is a controversial subject here but its worth a try

[supernova777]

ive found another g4 restore disc im downloading now..  from max
hopefully its the 2003 10.2.3 version

annddddd its not.. its the same 2002 imac g4 restore cds..
containing mac os rom 9.1.1 version...

[supernova777]

ok!!!!
ive located the "mac os x install cd" for the imac g4 800mhz .. presumably the "x only" model..
downloading now and i will open the sucker up and try to find the mac os rom hidden deep within
if it even includes the os9 system folder.. 
did they stop including os9 in 2003?

[Knezzen]

ok!!!!
ive located the "mac os x install cd" for the imac g4 800mhz .. presumably the "x only" model..
downloading now and i will open the sucker up and try to find the mac os rom hidden deep within
if it even includes the os9 system folder.. 
did they stop including os9 in 2003?

There are two 800mhz models that support OS9, so you must be more specific .
I bet you mean M9105, right?

[supernova777]

im not sure im guessing its for the X only model
will find out in a sec

wow someones a real genius
this was an upload to max ftp
someone just zipped the folders of the imac g4 os x install cd instead of making a cd image LOL
wow what a fail
anyway theres no rom file anywhere on the disc at all that i can see.

the chart above clearly shows 9.22 on the restore disc tho..

[supernova777]

Who has a 3rd party CPU???

Who has a 3rd party utility for saving original firmware?

who has sonnet encore ST?

who has the G4 ROM Utility made by Sonnet?

wake up wake up

[MacTron]

I have the NewerTech firmware patch. It allows a G4 7448/7447 CPU upgrade run Mac Os 9.2 or Mac os X on a Sawtooth...

[supernova777]

what im talking about is a utility that allows u to save the original firmware for doing just such a patch....
it reads the firmware + saves it to a file... enabling the user to be able to restore their original firmware in the event that
the cpu is uninstalled.

this is the utility to be used to take the mac os 9 bootable firmware from os9 bootable version of the imac g4 product line
to be able to attempt to take this firmware + write it to the 800mhz X only imac g4 (which has the same motherboard as the other 9 booting lowend models of imac g4)

and.. for someone brave enough.. to try this on the models that followed that had a significantly different motherboard (at a risk) to gain os9 bootability.

newertech + powerlogic + sonnet are all said to have these types of "rom saving" utilities to facilitate patching + unpatching for 3rd party cpu

the software packages that came with these 3rd party cpus is where someone needs to look to find this or possibly a download from a web backup of their sites.

[MacTron]

I'm not following this thread. But, you are trying to boot a iMac G4 800 in Mac os 9?
What type of screen it have: 15 inch or 17?
The Apple iMac G4/800 - X Only (15 inch Flat Panel) is te easiest to boot into Mac Os 9 again ... LOL

[supernova777]

I'm not following this thread. But, you are trying to boot a iMac G4 800 in Mac os 9?

i give up.... 

you are the one who started the thread!!!!!!!

[MacTron]

I'm not following this thread. But, you are trying to boot a iMac G4 800 in Mac os 9?

i give up.... 

you are the one who started the thread!!!!!!!

Yes. I started this thread, just to try to keep a bit of organization...

[MacTron]

what im talking about is a utility that allows u to save the original firmware for doing just such a patch....
it reads the firmware + saves it to a file... enabling the user to be able to restore their original firmware in the event that
the cpu is uninstalled.

this is the utility to be used to take the mac os 9 bootable firmware from os9 bootable version of the imac g4 product line
to be able to attempt to take this firmware + write it to the 800mhz X only imac g4 (which has the same motherboard as the other 9 booting lowend models of imac g4)

and.. for someone brave enough.. to try this on the models that followed that had a significantly different motherboard (at a risk) to gain os9 bootability.

newertech + powerlogic + sonnet are all said to have these types of "rom saving" utilities to facilitate patching + unpatching for 3rd party cpu

the software packages that came with these 3rd party cpus is where someone needs to look to find this or possibly a download from a web backup of their sites.

I don't know if I have such tool...
But what NewerTech does, and probably other G4 CPU upgrade vendors isn't read and white or patch the Machine firmware, but they do change the Machine "setup" in the Open Firmware, all the changes are in volatile memory, and can be lost if you do a PRAM reset. Never they do a Firmware change. AFAIK

The firmware change is a "brute force method" and may work or render the machine unusable forever...

The best way is learn how to enable or disable some things in OF...

BTW, the Newertech scripts are done by Alessandro Levi Montalcini.

The Apple iMac G4/800 - X Only (15 inch Flat Panel) is te easiest to boot into Mac Os 9 again ... LOL

... because is a Mac Os ROM *only* question...

[supernova777]

if they did the imac g4 lock out of os9 bootability the same way as the g4 MDD FW800..
the ability to recognize the toolbox image was just *disabled* at firmware level --that is -- the machines firmware
 that is stored in flash ram accessed by "openfirmware" bios...
which is why this extra code (or lack of toolbox image handling code) was removed by flashing the machines firmware with the fw400 firmware

why would it be any different with the "X only" imac flat panel?

which makes me think of the question:
did anyone try to look at this firmware file with a hex editor?

the firmware of the fw400 g4 mdd?
https://www.macupdate.com/app/mac/10773/apple-g4-firmware-updater-x
"PMG4FWUpdate.dmg.bin"

The Power Mac G4 Firmware Update 4.4.8 will run only on Power Mac G4 computers with Mirrored Drive Doors. The Power Mac G4 Firmware Update 4.4.8 improves fan control behavior and reduces high speed fan cycling when running in Mac OS 9.

if it wasnt for this fan problem they would never have made this file available.

[MacTron]

why would it be any different with the "X only" imac flat panel?

Because they had a little problem with Apple Harware Test for the iMac 800 15"  Os X only ... LOL

[supernova777]

just an update.. i found mac os rom 10.1.1 inside the bootable image for the emac 800mhz restore disc

[MacTron]

just an update.. i found mac os rom 10.1.1 inside the bootable image for the emac 800mhz restore disc

Yes, this 10.1.1 ROM adds support for the emac.
The 10.2.1 MDD version don't adds support for new models, may be it is just a bug fix...

Probably both rooms boot the iMac 800 15" (Os X only), besides the famous Custer ROM.

[supernova777]

i thought the whole purpose of this thread was to extend the same theory that made the fw800 g4 able to boot os9
via a machine firmware downgrade

the mac os rom played no part in enabling the fw800 to boot mac os 9..
i realize that some people have had some success by hacking the rom, but this was only partial success.

shouldnt the approach be focused on extracting the firmware from the 700mhz + 800mhz imac g4s that have true os9 support
and then on forcing a firmware flash of that firmware to the x only 800mhz imac g4 via openfirmware??