Mac OS 9 Lives

Mac OS 9 Discussion => Mac OS 9, Hacks & Upgrades => Topic started by: MacTron on September 22, 2015, 11:54:26 AM

Title: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: MacTron on September 22, 2015, 11:54:26 AM
(http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/mac-os-9-boot-screen-with-extensions-610x414.jpg)

To boot a computer with Mac Os 9, we need:

#1- A Mac Os 9 capable computer.
#2- An HFS volume with Mac Os 9 drivers.
#3- A Mac Os 9 System folder.

Notes:

#1- All g3 and most of G4 are Mac Os 9 capable computers. This can be checked at http://www.everymac.com/ (http://www.everymac.com/). Furthermore, some of unsupported Macs can be booted via special procedures ...

#2- An HFS volume can be a Hard Disk, a CD-ROM or an external device connected via USB (including pendrives), Firewire or eSATA.
Drive Setup (in Mac Os 9) and Disk Utility (in Os X) can format HFS+ devices with Mac Os 9 drivers. Gparted (Linux) can create HFS volumes but without Mac Os 9 drives, so aren't bootables.

#3- In the Mac Os 9 system folder, the Mac Os ROM, System and Finder files are the ONLY files needed to boot (well, the Finder isn't really necessary to boot, in fact it can be changed for any other app), the remaining files and folders are optionals and can be fully wiped for troubleshooting procedures.
The System and ROM versions should be the same or later versions from the ones that the computer come with.

The Startup folder should be selected in the Startup Disk control panel:

(http://www.macos.utah.edu/documentation/operating_systems/mac_os_9-1/whats_new/mainColumnParagraphs/0119/image/startup_disk_window.gif)

 This settings can be temporary bypassed pressing the option key during startup:

(http://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/irf_guide_linzmayer_mac/elementLinks/fig107.jpg)
Title: CHAPTER #2 - Background Information...
Post by: DieHard on September 22, 2015, 02:26:15 PM
Below you will find some general background info:

What versions of Mac OS can my mac run?
http://support.apple.com/kb/ht1835

Mac OS Versions vs Release Dates:

http://www.guidebookgallery.org/timelines/macos

WHICH VERSION TO LOAD ?[/u]
Unfortunately, there has always been a heated debate on which Mac OS 9 version to install. In general, many users have favored the very last revision, Mac OS 9.2.2 as the most stable and preferred version. However, I can tell you from personal experience that it is best to do some research after you decide upon your favorite application(s). You can probably rule out V9.0, V9.02, V9.03, and V9.04 for stability issues and the lack of enhancements. So, you are half way there, with only V9.1, V9.2, V9.2.1, and V9.2.2 to consider.

If your Mac system restore leaves you in the V9.0 realm, it can be patched as follows:
MacOS 9.1 Update --> MacOS 9.2.1 Update --> MacOS 9.2.2 Update

IF YOU ARE GOING TO USE A HARD DRIVE GREATER THAN 128 GB USE Mac OS 9.2.2
If you intend to use PATA/IDE hard drives larger than 128GB under OS 9, then be aware that you will need the combination of a Mac with an IDE controller that is 48-bit LBA compliant and operating system version 9.2.2

What the hell is 48-bit LBA compliant, you ask?
Well, it is the ability of the Mac to see the total number of heads, cylinders, and sectors of large hard drives.
We have tested the following Macs and they can see hard drives of up to 500GB within Mac OS 9.2.2: QuickSilver 733, QuickSilver 800, QuickSilver DP 800, QuickSilver 867, QuickSilver 933, QuickSilver Dual 1 GHz with logic board 820-1342-B (QS logic board 820-1276-A will NOT work and peak out at 128 GB), All FW400 MDD models, Titanium PowerBook 800, Titanium PowerBook 867, Titanium PowerBook 1Ghz will work nicely.

With drives over 128GB, as far as the Mac OS revision, you will be stuck with Mac OS 9.2.2 only, as it contains Apple Drive Setup V2.1.  This version of this app is the first version to support larger drives and will be needed to format and partition drives greater than 128GB. We also recommend that you keep your partitions to sizes of 190GB or less.. exceeding this size has some ramifications .. (2 of them) .. 1st) OS 9 will not boot and 2nd) Norton Speed Disk V6.03 will not be able to defrag it.

To clarify, if you are putting a 500GB IDE drive into your Mac, simply break it into 3 partitions:
*format all volumes Mac OS Extended
Title: CHAPTER 3 - Downloading and Installing...
Post by: DieHard on September 22, 2015, 02:43:12 PM
Mac OS 9.2.2 Universal Install - ISO CD Image - Our Most Popular Download

DOWNLOAD LINK: http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2109.0.html

Advantages:
1) No Need to Install OS X, No DMG or other image files Needed
2) No Need for any Additional Updates or Patches; this install contains newer versions of the Video extensions and the Mac OS ROM file as compared to the famous "General.dmg" disk image that is floating around the web, so it would be wise to use the Mac OS9 Lives install CD-ROM which has the latest versions.

Details: Full version of 9.2.2 for all Mac G3 and G4 Systems, it contains: Mac OS ROM Version 10.2.1, Mac OS CPU Software 5.9 from 04.2003, Graphics Card Updates from 10.2002

Simply Download the Image, Burn to a CD-ROM, Boot to the CD-ROM and follow the included on-screen instructions
Title: CHAPTER 4 - Extensions, Control Panels, and General Tweaks after Install
Post by: DieHard on September 22, 2015, 03:02:14 PM
Network related extensions:
Apple Enet 2.4.5, AppleShare 3.9.4, Open Transport 2.8.3, Open Transport ASLM Modules 2.8.3, Shared Library Manager PPC 2.0.2, Internet Config Extension 2.0.7

USB/FireWire related extensions:
FireWire Enabler 2.8.7, FireWire Support 2.8.7, HID Library 1.5.9, USB Device Extension 1.5.9

QuickTime And Sound Manager related extensions:
Apple Audio Extension 2.4, Sound Manager 3.7.1, QuickTime Extensions, QuickTime 6.0.3, QuickTime Musical Instruments 6.0.2, QuickTime  PowerPlug 6.0.3

OpenG related extensions:
OpenGLEngine 1.2.4, OpenGLLibrary 1.2.5, OpenGLMemory 1.2.4, OpenGLRenderer 1.2.4, OpenGLUtility 1.2.4

Video card related extensions:
NVIDIA 2D Acceleration 3.5.2, NVIDIA Drive 3.5.2, NVIDIA DVD Accelerator 3.5.2, NVIDIA Engine 3.5.2, NVIDIA OpenGL 3.5.2, NVIDIA Video Accelerator 3.5.2

Other Extensions:
DrawSprocketLib 1.7.8, InputSprocket Extension 1.7.3, Time Synchronizer 8.3.3, Contextual Menu Extension 1.0.2, Joliet Volume Access 2.1b5,
Text Encoding Converter 1.6, Apple CD/DVD Driver 1.4.8, DVD Region Manager 1.1, CarbonLib 1.6.1, Multiprocessing

Control Panels:
Joliet Control 2.1b5,USB Overdrive 1.4,Appearance 1.1.4,Date & Time 8.3.3, Energy Saver 3.0.5,File Exchange 3.0.5, General Controls 8.0.3, Internet 1.0.3, Keyboard 8.6.2,Memory 8.1.3,Monitors 7.5.6, Numbers7.1,QuickTime Settings 6.0.2, Sound      8.5.8, Startup Disk 9.2.6,TCP/IP 2.5,Text  8.0

I will not explain the function of every control panel and extension here, you can google something if you are curious or use this as a quick start guide and take the advice on pure faith...

1) INITIAL TWEAKS

- Memory ControlPanel
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click MEMORY
Turn Virtual Memory OFF
Be Sure RAM DISK is OFF.

- Energy Saver Control Panel
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click ENERGY SAVER
In the SLEEP SETUP page, set “Put the system to sleep” at NEVER.
(It is also recommended that the SLEEP command not be used from the "Special" menu)

- Disable Appletalk
From the Apple Menu, click CHOOSER
Click INACTIVE in next to the Appletalk option at the bottom right corner of the window.

- Disable Font Smoothing
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click APPEARANCE
Click the FONTS tab inside the Appearance window.
Disable the option “SMOOTH ALL FONTS”

2) VIDEO CARD INFORMATION (needed for later on)
From the Apple Menu, click "Apple System Profiler"
Select the Second Tab at the top "Devices and Volumes"
Under the PCI, Slot-1, AGP section, click the blue triangle to the left of "Display Card" to open the Video card info. write down the card Manufacturer

3) EXTENSIONS AND CONTROL PANELS
Trim your Extensions & Controls Panels to help performance and prevent possible extension conflicts; if you are a Newbie to OS 9, when in doubt, don't turn off an extension unless you are sure you don't need it, the amount of RAM saved is not worth the headache you are going to have if you inadvertently turned off something you need and don't realize it...if you want to experiment, you can use this guide first as a baseline and then pick "Duplicate Set" and try variations of your initial modified setup, that way, you can easily switch back if you make a mistake

From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click EXTENSIONS MANAGER..
Click “Duplicate Set” at the bottom right corner of the Extensions Manager window. Name the duplicate set when prompted… something like "Recording Studio Mac" or your name as an Artist or Production Company

Sort First... it will make the below list much easier !
Click on the word "Package" at the top of the Package column to immediate sort the Control Panels and Extensions, this will immediately give you a bird's eye view of which packages belong together

- Control Panels to turn off

If you don't intend on using a dial-up telephone modem..
Remove the X from
     DialAssist
     Modem
     Remote Access

Also, Remove the X from
     Location Manager
     Multiple Users (assuming you are the only user, you better be, don'y let anyone use your Music Mac)
     Software Update
     USB Printer Sharing (who likes to share anyway)
     Web Sharing

- Extensions to turn off

If you don't have an Airport Wireless Card Installed...
Remove the X from
     Airport AP
     Airport AP Support
     Airport Driver

If you don't access your Mac remotely...
Remove the X from
     OpenTpt Remote Access
     OpenTpt Serial Arbitrator
     Remote Only

If you don't Voice Control your Mac...
Remove the X from
     Speech Recognition

If you use iTunes, but don't own a Nomad, SoundSpace, or Rio (I don't think you own any of these)...
Remove the X from
     Nomad II USB Driver
     Nomad MG USB Driver
     Nomad USB shim
     NomadJukeboxLib
     SoundSpace2Lib
     NomadJukeboxLib Driver
     USBRioDriver
     USBSoundSpace2 Driver

To turn off hard drive file indexing (trust me, you want it off)
Remove the X from
     FBC Indexing Scheduler

No Zip or Jaz drive ?
Remove the X from
     Iomega Drive

Some to trust me on... unless you know otherwise
Remove the X from
     Location Manager Extension
     Multi-User Startup
     Serial Tool
     Software Update Engine
     Software Update Scheduler
     Voice Verification
     VT102 Tool
     XMODEM Tool
     Web Sharing Extension
     Setup Assistant API
     Setup Assistant Launcher
     Setup Info Dispatcher
     Setup Internet Support
     Setup Modem Selector

To turn off un-needed video extensions (remember you found out your video card in Step 2
If you have an nVidia Card
Remove the X from
     All Extensions with "ATI" in them

If you have an ATI Card
Remove the X from
     All Extensions with "nVidia" in them

4) ADVANCED TRICKS & TIPS:
After an Initial Mac OS 9 Install navigate to the Extensions folder in the System Folder, select all the files (hold down Command/Apple and press 'A'), and label them with a color. This way, any third-party extensions added subsequently are easy to spot since they will appear with a different color to the original set and these colours will be visible in Extensions Manager!
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Graveyard on September 22, 2015, 07:06:10 PM
The disc images you guys made here helped me install OS9 on my dual 1,25GHz MDD without any work. The only thing i have to do now is install all my emulators and stuff since i now can take advantage of my 250+GB ide drives i had saved before getting this bad boy and the Radeon 9000 card with ADB. So thank you guys!

PS: can anyone help with some pre-OS8 things?
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bsharvy on July 14, 2019, 06:44:12 PM
Can a graphite G4 boot over the Ethernet? I have a DA Mac with no hard drive, and a Time Capsule. Wondering if I can boot that way (or with an Airport Extreme with a USB drive plugged in, which I assume would be faster than plugging the drive into the USB 1.1 port).
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: IIO on July 14, 2019, 07:33:49 PM
https://support.apple.com/kb/DL1192?locale=de_DE
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bsharvy on July 15, 2019, 12:22:03 PM
Hi. thanks for the link. I don't understand how that would work. Where would I install software to make the computer look for a boot drive over Ethernet? It wouldn't make sense to install it on the Ethernet drive....
Title: Re: CHAPTER #2 - Background Information...
Post by: bsharvy on July 16, 2019, 02:50:38 PM

IF YOU ARE GOING TO USE A HARD DRIVE GREATER THAN 128 GB USE Mac OS 9.2.2
If you intend to use PATA/IDE hard drives larger than 128GB under OS 9, then be aware that you will need the combination of a Mac with an IDE controller that is 48-bit LBA compliant and operating system version 9.2.2

What the hell is 48-bit LBA compliant, you ask?
Well, it is the ability of the Mac to see the total number of heads, cylinders, and sectors of large hard drives.
We have tested the following Macs and they can see hard drives of up to 500GB within Mac OS 9.2.2: QuickSilver 733, QuickSilver 800, QuickSilver DP 800, QuickSilver 867, QuickSilver 933, QuickSilver Dual 1 GHz with logic board 820-1342-B (QS logic board 820-1276-A will NOT work and peak out at 128 GB), All FW400 MDD models, Titanium PowerBook 800, Titanium PowerBook 867, Titanium PowerBook 1Ghz will work nicely.

With drives over 128GB, as far as the Mac OS revision, you will be stuck with Mac OS 9.2.2 only, as it contains Apple Drive Setup V2.1.  This version of this app is the first version to support larger drives and will be needed to format and partition drives greater than 128GB. We also recommend that you keep your partitions to sizes of 190GB or less.. exceeding this size has some ramifications .. (2 of them) .. 1st) OS 9 will not boot and 2nd) Norton Speed Disk V6.03 will not be able to defrag it.

To clarify, if you are putting a 500GB IDE drive into your Mac, simply break it into 3 partitions:
  • 120GB (os volume)
  • 190GB (data volume) --190gb being the highest size while maintaining compatibility with defrag
  • 190GB (data volume) --190gb being the highest size while maintaining compatibility with defrag
*format all volumes Mac OS Extended

What about external Firewire drives?
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bsharvy on July 16, 2019, 03:06:14 PM
I can't get  anything on this Web site to work. I formatted a USB flash drive and a powered Firewire drive as "HFS+ (Journaled)" and installed OS 9.2.2 on them. The G4 wouldn't boot from them. Is there something I'm missing?
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: macarone on July 16, 2019, 07:54:54 PM
>I formatted a USB flash drive and a powered Firewire drive as "HFS+ (Journaled)"

If the computer is going to boot into OS 9, it will probably just have USB 1, and therefore be unsuitable.

When you formatted the FireWire drive, did you check "Install OS 9 drivers" ?
This is absolutely necessary.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: macStuff on July 17, 2019, 01:41:40 AM
forget about using USB with a mac g3/g4
usb is only for keyboards + mice on these computers
usb is for osx only; in combination with usb2.0 ports (which are only found on osx only g4/g5s)


pro tip: buy a firewire 400 enclosure  (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=%28firewire%2C1394a%29+%28enclosure%2C+dock%29&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_sop=15)
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bsharvy on July 19, 2019, 12:10:28 PM
I did eventually get it working. I booted off the USB flash drive, and eventually off an external Firewire 400 drive. I never tried using Ethernet + drive over Airport Extreme or Time Capsule.
Title: Re: CHAPTER #2 - Background Information...
Post by: IIO on July 19, 2019, 06:46:05 PM
What about external Firewire drives?

up to < 2 TB.

use OSX 10.4.x (not OS9 nor 10.5.x) to format your drives, this saves a lot of headache.

except for booting: then then you always need one < 190 partition for the system folder.

Title: Re: CHAPTER 4 - Extensions, Control Panels, and General Tweaks after Install
Post by: Roman323 on April 15, 2020, 01:37:53 AM
Network related extensions:
Apple Enet 2.4.5, AppleShare 3.9.4, Open Transport 2.8.3, Open Transport ASLM Modules 2.8.3, Shared Library Manager PPC 2.0.2, Internet Config Extension 2.0.7

USB/FireWire related extensions:
FireWire Enabler 2.8.7, FireWire Support 2.8.7, HID Library 1.5.9, USB Device Extension 1.5.9

QuickTime And Sound Manager related extensions:
Apple Audio Extension 2.4, Sound Manager 3.7.1, QuickTime Extensions, QuickTime 6.0.3, QuickTime Musical Instruments 6.0.2, QuickTime  PowerPlug 6.0.3

OpenG related extensions:
OpenGLEngine 1.2.4, OpenGLLibrary 1.2.5, OpenGLMemory 1.2.4, OpenGLRenderer 1.2.4, OpenGLUtility 1.2.4

Video card related extensions:
NVIDIA 2D Acceleration 3.5.2, NVIDIA Drive 3.5.2, NVIDIA DVD Accelerator 3.5.2, NVIDIA Engine 3.5.2, NVIDIA OpenGL 3.5.2, NVIDIA Video Accelerator 3.5.2

Other Extensions:
DrawSprocketLib 1.7.8, InputSprocket Extension 1.7.3, Time Synchronizer 8.3.3, Contextual Menu Extension 1.0.2, Joliet Volume Access 2.1b5,
Text Encoding Converter 1.6, Apple CD/DVD Driver 1.4.8, DVD Region Manager 1.1, CarbonLib 1.6.1, Multiprocessing

Control Panels:
Joliet Control 2.1b5,USB Overdrive 1.4,Appearance 1.1.4,Date & Time 8.3.3, Energy Saver 3.0.5,File Exchange 3.0.5, General Controls 8.0.3, Internet 1.0.3, Keyboard 8.6.2,Memory 8.1.3,Monitors 7.5.6, Numbers7.1,QuickTime Settings 6.0.2, Sound      8.5.8, Startup Disk 9.2.6,TCP/IP 2.5,Text  8.0

I will not explain the function of every control panel and extension here, you can google something if you are curious or use this as a quick start guide and take the advice on pure faith...

1) INITIAL TWEAKS

- Memory ControlPanel
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click MEMORY
Turn Virtual Memory OFF
Be Sure RAM DISK is OFF.

- Energy Saver Control Panel
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click ENERGY SAVER
In the SLEEP SETUP page, set “Put the system to sleep” at NEVER.
(It is also recommended that the SLEEP command not be used from the "Special" menu)

- Disable Appletalk
From the Apple Menu, click CHOOSER
Click INACTIVE in next to the Appletalk option at the bottom right corner of the window.

- Disable Font Smoothing
From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click APPEARANCE
Click the FONTS tab inside the Appearance window.
Disable the option “SMOOTH ALL FONTS”

2) VIDEO CARD INFORMATION (needed for later on)
From the Apple Menu, click "Apple System Profiler"
Select the Second Tab at the top "Devices and Volumes"
Under the PCI, Slot-1, AGP section, click the blue triangle to the left of "Display Card" to open the Video card info. write down the card Manufacturer

3) EXTENSIONS AND CONTROL PANELS
Trim your Extensions & Controls Panels to help performance and prevent possible extension conflicts; if you are a Newbie to OS 9, when in doubt, don't turn off an extension unless you are sure you don't need it, the amount of RAM saved is not worth the headache you are going to have if you inadvertently turned off something you need and don't realize it...if you want to experiment, you can use this guide first as a baseline and then pick "Duplicate Set" and try variations of your initial modified setup, that way, you can easily switch back if you make a mistake

From the Apple Menu, choose the “Control Panels” pop-up, and click EXTENSIONS MANAGER..
Click “Duplicate Set” at the bottom right corner of the Extensions Manager window. Name the duplicate set when prompted… something like "Recording Studio Mac" or your name as an Artist or Production Company

Sort First... it will make the below list much easier !
Click on the word "Package" at the top of the Package column to immediate sort the Control Panels and Extensions, this will immediately give you a bird's eye view of which packages belong together

- Control Panels to turn off

If you don't intend on using a dial-up telephone modem..
Remove the X from
     DialAssist
     Modem
     Remote Access

Also, Remove the X from
     Location Manager
     Multiple Users (assuming you are the only user, you better be, don'y let anyone use your Music Mac)
     Software Update
     USB Printer Sharing (who likes to share anyway)
     Web Sharing

- Extensions to turn off

If you don't have an Airport Wireless Card Installed...
Remove the X from
     Airport AP
     Airport AP Support
     Airport Driver

If you don't access your Mac remotely...
Remove the X from
     OpenTpt Remote Access
     OpenTpt Serial Arbitrator
     Remote Only

If you don't Voice Control your Mac...
Remove the X from
     Speech Recognition

If you use iTunes, but don't own a Nomad, SoundSpace, or Rio (I don't think you own any of these)...
Remove the X from
     Nomad II USB Driver
     Nomad MG USB Driver
     Nomad USB shim
     NomadJukeboxLib
     SoundSpace2Lib
     NomadJukeboxLib Driver
     USBRioDriver
     USBSoundSpace2 Driver

To turn off hard drive file indexing (trust me, you want it off)
Remove the X from
     FBC Indexing Scheduler

No Zip or Jaz drive ?
Remove the X from
     Iomega Drive

Some to trust me on... unless you know otherwise
Remove the X from
     Location Manager Extension
     Multi-User Startup
     Serial Tool
     Software Update Engine
     Software Update Scheduler
     Voice Verification
     VT102 Tool
     XMODEM Tool
     Web Sharing Extension
     Setup Assistant API
     Setup Assistant Launcher
     Setup Info Dispatcher
     Setup Internet Support
     Setup Modem Selector

To turn off un-needed video extensions (remember you found out your video card in Step 2
If you have an nVidia Card
Remove the X from
     All Extensions with "ATI" in them

If you have an ATI Card
Remove the X from
     All Extensions with "nVidia" in them

4) ADVANCED TRICKS & TIPS:
After an Initial Mac OS 9 Install navigate to the Extensions folder in the System Folder, select all the files (hold down Command/Apple and press 'A'), and label them with a color. This way, any third-party extensions added subsequently are easy to spot since they will appear with a different color to the original set and these colours will be visible in Extensions Manager!.

Ok, I did not have a CD, but a DVD will that make a difference ? I could not get my Powerbook G4 DLSD to recognize the installer. Tried to copy it to a USB and typed under OF -> boot ud:,\\:tbxi and nothing booted. What am I doing wrong or is this not even going to work on a PowerBook from 2006 DLSD DDR2 ?
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: IIO on April 15, 2020, 10:19:24 AM
a powerbook from 2006 wont run it at all.

for a list of machines post 2001 which support OS9 - natively or by hacks - check the different OS9 installers in our download section.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bfcastello on November 11, 2021, 09:12:13 PM
Hi, I have a (vanilla) macOS 9.2.1 install in a QEMU virtual machine, and I have noticed that the custom Mac OS 9 Lives disk images have a newer MacOS ROM.

I am still learning about this classic macOS. So I have no clue about what are the main differences between both versions and its benefits. However, I want to stay as vanilla as possible for a more interesting experience of the past, so I'd rather not have to reinstall everything just to stay updated, if possible. I don't have THAT much time these days (work is consuming me).

Can anyone advise me on how to update the MacOS ROM? Does I have to update to 9.2.2 and does it have any benefit over the one in my 9.2.1 install?

Thanks in advance! MacOS9 is indeed a very interesting part of the Apple history.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: IIO on November 11, 2021, 10:46:03 PM
you could just swap the file, but dont do this when you currently dont have another option around to boot this machine into whatever in case you need to revert that.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: bfcastello on November 14, 2021, 10:41:54 PM
you could just swap the file, but dont do this when you currently dont have another option around to boot this machine into whatever in case you need to revert that.

That's fine, it's a virtual machine. I was actually running 9.2.2 on this VM (I can't remember how or when I did update). In my tests I have noticed that there is no benefit at all for me to run this VM with a newer MacOS ROM. QEMU does not grab the mouse when I move over the VM screen when using the newer version; I had to tell QEMU to do it with a keystroke. So I reverted to my backup with the older rom (8.7) and decided to stick with it. "If it's not broken..." ya know? :P But thanks anyway!
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Underdog on June 18, 2022, 02:47:11 PM
Hello all. Happy to be here.

Got a original Mac Mini G4 and I can't get it to boot from the CD/DVD drive. Drive functions normally if I boot from the existing HD with OSX.

Using a Windows USB keyboard.

Thanks in advance.

Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: IIO on June 18, 2022, 04:55:10 PM
no idea if the keyboard could be the problem.

for optical i dont think so, for optical you need to hold "c" and not a modifier key. :)

and when i say "c" i mean "c" - make sure that caps lock is not down!
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginners
Post by: FBz on June 18, 2022, 06:53:24 PM
You are using a CD successfully burned from this download
(in order to install OS 9.2.2 on a G4 Mac mini)? ;)

http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,4365.0.html

IF so, and it still won’t boot from the CD & “c” key boot…
try holding down the Option key with the CD in, at boot.

If that also fails, get back to us for the “Open Firmware” boot routine.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Underdog on June 19, 2022, 06:23:26 AM
Many thaks for your support.

Found this and it works.

<https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-mini-g4-macos-92-v9>

Thanks again.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Astrin on September 26, 2023, 06:42:17 PM
Many thaks for your support.

Found this and it works.

<https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-mini-g4-macos-92-v9>

Thanks again.

Kinda funny that the one post on this entire forum that actually works is from a new user! As I am.
I've lost count on how many posts have 'most downloaded' or 'for unsupported G4' etc.
Like Bullwinkle saying 'This time for sure!'
Seriously I am VERY grateful for the work that has gone into these various ISO's and I will be contributing but I cannot fathom how my stock G4 mini and Powermac G4 MDD 800 FW don't work with these supposedly tested and confirmed builds--these computers haven't changed in 20 years, so no new drivers or components have been incorporated. And the posting on the 'garden' may be a user here, so I am grateful for him also.
So thanks
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: ssp3 on September 26, 2023, 06:59:45 PM
FYI - garden gets its iso's from here.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: DieHard on September 26, 2023, 07:08:49 PM
Quote
Seriously I am VERY grateful for the work that has gone into these various ISO's and I will be contributing but I cannot fathom how my stock G4 mini and Powermac G4 MDD 800 FW don't work with these supposedly tested and confirmed builds--these computers haven't changed in 20 years, so no new drivers or components have been incorporated. And the posting on the 'garden' may be a user here, so I am grateful for him also.

Obviously the "Universal Installer" won't work for either of those, as universal was designated by Apple to mean for all machines machines that were meant to natively boot to OS9.

Both of your units need "special" versions: both are here, both work perfectly, both were created here, so we are in agreement as I cannot fathom it either...

G4 Mini:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,4365.0.html

G4 MDD 800:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2143.0.html

Here are some notes for your machine in case you don't read the download page...

Model Specific Hardware Notes:
1. Apple Power Macintosh G4 1.25 DP (FW 800) (Identifiers: M8570, M8840LL/A, Firewire 800, PowerMac3,6)
Firewire 800 ports are seen as FW400 ports are FW400 ports are Not recognized, all other hardware functions as normal

2. Apple Power Macintosh G4 1.42 DP (FW 800) (Identifiers: M8570, M8840LL/A, Firewire 800, PowerMac3,6)
Firewire 800 ports are seen as FW400 ports are FW400 ports are Not recognized, all other hardware functions as normal


Your Garden Post:
Quote
I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS FINALLY WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
What is it with macOS9lives? All the 'this is for unsupported G4's, heck even the mini and the Powermac G4 MDD 800 FW' and the 'no OF commands to type, just burn the ISO and install'. I feel like I'm on a used car lot being sold a lemon! Now the poster here deserves all of our gratitude especially if he was involved in the development, as well as the folks at macOS9lives, but the latter needs some serious culling and editing of their stuff over there. Sheesh!
And this is on Version 9 WOW!
Now the million dollar question--will this work on my G4 Powermac MDD 800 FW? Or is there another post here that will do the trick. Please don't make me watch another 7 year old video on YT that doesn't work

As far as your million dollar question, No it won't... use the link I posted above, every download CLEARLY states what it is for, So why would you try the "mini" install on the MDD ?!
For a guy that sounds like he tried everything, start by reading

No Open firmware commands are needed

Quote
I feel like I'm on a used car lot being sold a lemon! Now the poster here deserves all of our gratitude especially if he was involved in the development

Yeah, he is a valued member here and he (RossDarker) assembled it into a CD (injected it from our other ASR installs) and added all the work that was done here:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2408.0.html
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Astrin on September 29, 2023, 12:48:25 PM
Where's the Ultra Red Face emoji?

Hey it was my first post, and it was mostly after about a week of frustration, trying a lot of things, watching too many YT videos, and being amazed and chagrined at what retro mac guys had been able to accomplish. In my defense I only tried the Universal Install after I had tried the G4 mini Install -- which I used only for the mini BTW. It was only when I saw the RossDarker post on the'Garden' that worked that I again tried a build for the Powermac, which I found on the Garden, and that worked also.
 
And yes I know that the Garden iso's come from macos9lives, which is why I am extremely grateful and appreciative of all your work. Based on those YT videos, I surmised that there was a difference in the files between here and the Garden, or there was a problem with your hosting vs the Garden so that the d/l's weren't 100%. Whatever the reason, the iso's from here gave me a grey screen at bootup, whereas the Garden iso's booted up. That was my main issue--the grey screen non-response.

The d/l's were done on the same m2 mac mini, the cd's were burned on the same superdrive connected to the mac mini, so I was baffled at why the iso's from macos9lives and macintosh garden worked differently. If I ruffled any feathers, I apologize, but trust me I did read the instructions and I did read the various posts thoroughly. If it makes anyone feel better, chalk up to user error, I'm fine with that. I'm only sorry that I didn't catch it soon enough, as I was going to make edits to my 'one and only post' but you guys were so responsive that you beat me to it.  ;D

Anywhoo thanks guys
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Astrin on September 29, 2023, 12:51:52 PM
FYI - garden gets its iso's from here.

Yes I did know that. It says so on every post related to this subject.
More detailed response further into this thread.
Thanks :)
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Astrin on September 29, 2023, 12:56:38 PM
Quote
Seriously I am VERY grateful for the work that has gone into these various ISO's and I will be contributing but I cannot fathom how my stock G4 mini and Powermac G4 MDD 800 FW don't work with these supposedly tested and confirmed builds--these computers haven't changed in 20 years, so no new drivers or components have been incorporated. And the posting on the 'garden' may be a user here, so I am grateful for him also.

Obviously the "Universal Installer" won't work for either of those, as universal was designated by Apple to mean for all machines machines that were meant to natively boot to OS9.

Both of your units need "special" versions: both are here, both work perfectly, both were created here, so we are in agreement as I cannot fathom it either...

G4 Mini:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,4365.0.html

G4 MDD 800:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2143.0.html

Here are some notes for your machine in case you don't read the download page...

Model Specific Hardware Notes:
1. Apple Power Macintosh G4 1.25 DP (FW 800) (Identifiers: M8570, M8840LL/A, Firewire 800, PowerMac3,6)
Firewire 800 ports are seen as FW400 ports are FW400 ports are Not recognized, all other hardware functions as normal

2. Apple Power Macintosh G4 1.42 DP (FW 800) (Identifiers: M8570, M8840LL/A, Firewire 800, PowerMac3,6)
Firewire 800 ports are seen as FW400 ports are FW400 ports are Not recognized, all other hardware functions as normal


Your Garden Post:
Quote
I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS FINALLY WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
What is it with macOS9lives? All the 'this is for unsupported G4's, heck even the mini and the Powermac G4 MDD 800 FW' and the 'no OF commands to type, just burn the ISO and install'. I feel like I'm on a used car lot being sold a lemon! Now the poster here deserves all of our gratitude especially if he was involved in the development, as well as the folks at macOS9lives, but the latter needs some serious culling and editing of their stuff over there. Sheesh!
And this is on Version 9 WOW!
Now the million dollar question--will this work on my G4 Powermac MDD 800 FW? Or is there another post here that will do the trick. Please don't make me watch another 7 year old video on YT that doesn't work

As far as your million dollar question, No it won't... use the link I posted above, every download CLEARLY states what it is for, So why would you try the "mini" install on the MDD ?!
For a guy that sounds like he tried everything, start by reading

No Open firmware commands are needed

Quote
I feel like I'm on a used car lot being sold a lemon! Now the poster here deserves all of our gratitude especially if he was involved in the development

Yeah, he is a valued member here and he (RossDarker) assembled it into a CD (injected it from our other ASR installs) and added all the work that was done here:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,2408.0.html

Wanted to respond personally, and I do go into a bit more detail in my 'second' post. Thanks for your efforts and your patience. I really did read your posts thoroughly and I did follow the instructions. And I would like to be a part of the community so I meant no disparagement.
Thanks :)
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: DieHard on September 29, 2023, 01:29:19 PM
No problem at all, you are of course welcome to our community and I am glad your stuff is working... I just know that myself and our core members have spent countless hours assembling, creating, and testing stuff for the masses.  Our universal install has hit over 300K downloads.

So the only comment that kinda got to me was
Quote
macOS9lives, but the latter needs some serious culling and editing of their stuff over there. Sheesh!

Because I personally have spent many sleepless nights over the last 10 years to help as many I could, we did not whip this thing up in a week and put it on the web.  I have said my peace :)
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Astrin on September 29, 2023, 03:04:44 PM
No problem at all, you are of course welcome to our community and I am glad your stuff is working... I just know that myself and our core members have spent countless hours assembling, creating, and testing stuff for the masses.  Our universal install has hit over 300K downloads.

So the only comment that kinda got to me was
Quote
macOS9lives, but the latter needs some serious culling and editing of their stuff over there. Sheesh!

Because I personally have spent many sleepless nights over the last 10 years to help as many I could, we did not whip this thing up in a week and put it on the web.  I have said my peace :)

 :D I'm glad we're cool because I could see how much of an effort you've put into this. The instructions and even the layout for the post for the 'unsupported' G4 ISO post shows it. I wrote/spoke rashly due to extreme boomer-ness. Imagine Grampa Simpson shaking his fist, not at the sky as in the meme, but at the Grey Screen of WTF is wrong here. If you need help in testing/evaluating builds I'm available. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: macuser on April 06, 2024, 07:28:09 PM
I am trying to make a bootable macos9.2.2 in PowerBookG4 (1.5MHz 15" (SMS/BT2 - Al, PowerBook5,6 - A1106). However, I stumbled at the 1st step to install os9 driver ...Disk Utility of macOS 10.3.7 that came with this G4 machine, when trying to partition the HD, does not show an option for Apple Partition with os9 driver installation. 
I had tried Disk Utility in OS1-.4.11 (Tiger) for another machine.....again no option for Apple Partition.
How can I get an installer with an option for Apple Partition with os9 driver installation?
Title: Re: HELP - G4PB 1.5 GHz 15" (AL)
Post by: aBc on April 06, 2024, 08:24:46 PM
I am trying to make a bootable macos9.2.2 in PowerBookG4 (1.5GHz 15" (SMS/BT2 - Al, PowerBook5,6 - A1106). However, I stumbled at the 1st step to install os9 driver ...Disk Utility of macOS 10.3.7 that came with this G4 machine, when trying to partition the HD, does not show an option for Apple Partition with os9 driver installation. 
I had tried Disk Utility in OS1-.4.11 (Tiger) for another machine.....again no option for Apple Partition.
How can I get an installer with an option for Apple Partition with os9 driver installation?
Only thing I can find is this link:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=4278.msg29411#msg29411

Sorry not much help, I know. But maybe someone else can chime in here?
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: Knezzen on April 06, 2024, 11:02:41 PM
However, I stumbled at the 1st step to install os9 driver ...Disk Utility of macOS 10.3.7 that came with this G4 machine, when trying to partition the HD, does not show an option for Apple Partition with os9 driver installation.

That option wont be shown if the machine isn't officially supported by Mac OS 9, so you need to boot from the Mac OS 9 for unsupported machines CD and partition your drive that way. Or take the drive our and put it in a supported machine. Not sure if you can "trick" the OSX Disk Utility to show this option regardless though. Can't remember.
Title: Re: Mac OS 9 Booting and Installing for Beginers
Post by: macuser on April 07, 2024, 01:43:01 AM
(http://cdn.osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/mac-os-9-boot-screen-with-extensions-610x414.jpg)

To boot a computer with Mac Os 9, we need:

#1- A Mac Os 9 capable computer.
#2- An HFS volume with Mac Os 9 drivers.
#3- A Mac Os 9 System folder.

Notes:

#1- All g3 and most of G4 are Mac Os 9 capable computers. This can be checked at http://www.everymac.com/ (http://www.everymac.com/). Furthermore, some of unsupported Macs can be booted via special procedures ...

#2- An HFS volume can be a Hard Disk, a CD-ROM or an external device connected via USB (including pendrives), Firewire or eSATA.
Drive Setup (in Mac Os 9) and Disk Utility (in Os X) can format HFS+ devices with Mac Os 9 drivers. Gparted (Linux) can create HFS volumes but without Mac Os 9 drives, so aren't bootables.

#3- In the Mac Os 9 system folder, the Mac Os ROM, System and Finder files are the ONLY files needed to boot (well, the Finder isn't really necessary to boot, in fact it can be changed for any other app), the remaining files and folders are optionals and can be fully wiped for troubleshooting procedures.
The System and ROM versions should be the same or later versions from the ones that the computer come with.

The Startup folder should be selected in the Startup Disk control panel:

(http://www.macos.utah.edu/documentation/operating_systems/mac_os_9-1/whats_new/mainColumnParagraphs/0119/image/startup_disk_window.gif)

 This settings can be temporary bypassed pressing the option key during startup:

(http://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/irf_guide_linzmayer_mac/elementLinks/fig107.jpg)