My new studio build

[Knezzen]

Settled with Mac OS 9.2.2 and Pro Tools 5.1.3cs11. Seems like the best idea. Networking is getting sorted as we speak

Today the Pro Control got it's last fader wings! Looks awesome to fill up the desk we worked so hard building.
What do you guys think?   

[Mat]

No "proper" way to share files with the server running Mavericks and the iMac running Mavericks (…)
So what do you guys think? The biggest issue for me is by far the networking.

You could give "DoubleTalk" a try. It is a Samba implementation for Mac OS 9, and there are reports that it works great with 10.6. As I don´t use X you will have to try it on your own. Perhaps it works well with 10.9 also? It is at MacintoshGarden

[DieHard]

Way Cool Mat... never tried that one

Found some more info. http://www.macworld.com/article/1002290/doubletalk.html

[supernova777]

the best way for networking is to create an AFP file server..
i had made threads detailing how to do this with pc hardware + a package called nas4free (freenas) but those threads were deleted.
in my experience, creating an AFP fileserver has resulted in the best + fastest reliable mounted file server on both X + 9 and it
works fantastic.
unbelievably fast from os9. and very fast from intel osx aswell. i did not test mavericks as i had not installed this os yet. but i tested it from snow leopard + lion.
basically the performance over gigabit ethernet was so good it was basically just as fast as the internal drive.. i couldnt tell the difference practically.
it really blew my mind when literally none of u responded positively to my post because for me, it was quite the revelation.... AFP fileserver is the shit!!!!!

[DieHard]

I agree with Chris on this one... all SAMBA based solutions won't be as efficient as an AFP file server... however, if you only have 2 units to network, then even using "Go" "Sever" on the OS X Unit and typing in the IP address of the OS 9 unit will be sufficient.

Back in the day... For a few studios in New York that had at least 4 production rooms and 2 mixing/demo rooms we ran Novell with mac name space and AFP and everything ran flawless... the only PC was the actual Compaq Rack Mount Server (a PIII Proliant with RAID 5) and tracks were being bounced all over the place.... with small projects, you could even pull up the tracks and play them "Over the wire" from the server directly to the DAW... so rather than bore you...

If you have the space, the AFP solution provides...
1) Backup (setup the server with RAID)
2) Networking (Move all tracks all over the network, OS 9, OS X, etc.)
3) Centralized Archiving when the project is finished... smaller SSD in the production Macs for tracking and mixing and use server for storing when done

[Mat]

Basically I´d agree as well and say Netatalk is the best option. BUT; sadly the Netatalk team removed the AppleTalk support with "Netatalk 3.0 alpha1" in 2012, so the only option is afp via TCP/IP!

So if you like to use AppleTalk you have to use Netatalk 2.1.6 which is the last one that is working well with AppleTalk. Versions up to 2.2.4 do also not work with AppleTalk, as all 3.x do not. So I am using Netatalk 2.1.6 when connecting Linux with Mac OS 9. Read the "Classic Mac Networking Guide" if you need more informations: http://www.applefool.com/se30/

[DieHard]

Mat, thanks for that link !

That network Guide link is awesome... we should make a new thread, anyone with an older Mac needs to read that guide... thanks again

[Syntho]

I just use regular FTP clients and servers. Shouldn't that be good enough?

[MacOS9Lives.com]

Syntho, of course that is good enough... the Mac classic network guide is for Pre G4 systems and brings back a ton of awesome memories. The AFP discussion with MDDs and QS G4s really only comes into play when you have big studios and many rooms all sharing the same project from tracking to post production. One guy and 3 Macs=FTP solution, 5 guys and 10 macs=a more complex networking solution...

The days of big studios with AFP servers with RAID drives and long since dead... and maybe should be... A parallel evolution exists between Computer Networks and Audio production... Networking Racks of Servers with tons of fans and wires disappeared and were replaced a few fast computers equipped with Big Hard drives... ten racks of vintage outboard gear with 2 miles of spaghetti got replaced with 2 racks of our favorite stuff and virtual gear.

I liked designing and maintaining networks, but making music or choosing "Mix engineer" over "Network engineer" was always more fun. 

[supernova777]

I just use regular FTP clients and servers. Shouldn't that be good enough?

early implementations of AFP server software were available in Mac OS starting with System 6, in AppleShare and AppleShare IP, and in early "1.x" releases of Mac OS X Server. In client operating systems, AFP was called "Personal File Sharing", and supported up to ten simultaneous connections.[1] These AFP implementations relied on version 1.x or 2.x of the protocol. AppleShare IP 5.x, 6.x, and the "1.x" releases of Mac OS X Server introduced AFP version 2.2. This was the first version to offer transport connections using TCP/IP as well as AppleTalk. It also increased the maximum share point size from four gibibytes to two tebibytes,[1] although the maximum file size that could be stored remained at two gibibytes due to limitations in the original Mac OS.[2]

^^ this quote claims afp dates back to system 6 which was in the freaking 80s...


(apple file protocol)  was built for mac os. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol
its honestly stupid fast for os9 like faster then FTP dont ask me why
like i said when u mount the afp file server like a remote drive it basically feels like an internal drive the speed is so nice + fast
and its built for exactly that..  even tho on the remote drive the fiel system isnt macosxtended the afp protocol encapsulates all
metadata + resource forks + all the other mac wierdness.

pretty sure it auto remounts the afp share after reboot too.. its just.. solid as hell

for me the AFP fileserver acting as an interim share really works well ..  transfering.. backup.. but most importantly the software allows many different access methods..
to the same data.. and remote administration via web interface the same way that u would have on a modern purchased solution
its just easier to just work natively within mac os 9.. making folders .. dragging files.. etc without having to worry about ftp apps crashing or passwords and ports and all that crap

Computers using classic Mac OS can connect to AFP 3.x servers, with some limitations. For example, the maximum file size in Mac OS 8 is 2 gigabytes. Typically, Mac OS 9.1 or later is recommended for connecting to AFP 3.x servers; for versions of original Mac OS prior to 9.1, installation of the AppleShare client 3.8.8 is required.

AFP URLs take the form: afp://<server>/<share>, where <server> is the server's IP address, Domain Name System (DNS) name, or Bonjour name, and <share> is the name of the share point.

[supernova777]

Dual booting is not really the way to go for me. We are a couple of people using the same room and the same equipment, so it needs to be "easy" to use.
Im thinking of setting up netatalk on a Leopard machine to use with the OS9 machine and hopefully everything will get solved that way. I hope

honestly knez
if "Easy to use" is your goal..
do yourself a favour..
http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.aspx?id=620
just buy one of these..
supports AFP connection..
self contained unit with raid.. probably low power consumption.. fault tolerance... fast speed.. support for metadata/resource forks.. cant go wrong!
plug into your gigabit router and integrates seamless with any os  via SMB/cifs + with the old mac + new mac, AFP
u can access this natively inside mac os 9 like the local drive on the mac via the AFP protocol
i have posted about this over and over and over and still u guys have said NOTHING in response;)
only mactron has spoken about it!

[Knezzen]

Yeah, that might be something! I was thinking to take home an old Dell server from work, put in two SAS drives and make a RAID 1 array of them. Install some Linux distro and use Netatalk, but I don't feel like administrating it

BTW, to update on the studio build:
The studio is finished! We are now open for business and have been flooded with work (one if the reasons I haven't been very active here for the past months).

Have a look at our website: http://www.bankvalvet.com
It's in Swedish, but an english version is coming soon as well

[supernova777]

congrats

[Knezzen]

Thanks man!

[supernova777]

Yeah, that might be something! I was thinking to take home an old Dell server from work, put in two SAS drives and make a RAID 1 array of them. Install some Linux distro and use Netatalk, but I don't feel like administrating it

if u already have the drives id say do it.. but use NAS4FREE (http://www.nas4free.org/) as the OS off a 8gb thumb usb
and u can administrate it remotely over http

if u dont have the drives already i suggest the WD nas drive.. its a better solution. takes less power..

[Knezzen]

We got free electricity in the studio, so the power consumption is not a problem . I'll look into nas4free again. Thanks.

[supernova777]

We got free electricity in the studio, so the power consumption is not a problem . I'll look into nas4free again. Thanks.

trying to help.. because i have found through much trouble of my own, the solution to this.. and its a great solution.
just dont try to use "Freenas" by mistake. i had huge problems with freenas + smb

good luck

[Knezzen]

Lifting this 10 year old thread. I still have the stuff and started missing it so much that when we moved to our new house I put up the old Pro Tools MIX|24 rig again. Damn, this rig sounds INSANE. The workflow is wonderful. I'm back for good now

Picture of the same rig in it's new home. There's still a lot to be plugged in, but it's working

[Jubadub]

That setup is beautiful. Aah, that MDD on the side... What a fine touch, like a topping over a monumental dessert.

I know nothing about music production, though, so I am unqualified to appreciate the setup for its technical merits, but it looks badass and very fun.

[DieHard]

Don't know why you even doubted it