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Author Topic: Connecting a G4 quicksilver & a Powerbook 520c to an Akai dd1000 simultaneously  (Read 1564 times)

blaylok

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Hi there,

I want to Connect my G4 quicksilver & my Powerbook 520c to an Akai dd1000 simultaneously on the same scsi bus.

The Powerbook (running system 7.6.1) runs the akai dd1000 control software and the G4 running akai mesa to retrieve and import my recordings taken on the dd1000 into mesa and then into recycle etc.

The akai dd1000 has 2 x c50 scsi connection sockets but I am wondering if I am going to get scsi id conflicts because both computers will be on scsi id7? Can the internal Id of either machine be changed?

The G4 is running an adaptec 2930cu mac version scsi card.

Just wondering if anyone has had any experience or advice on this please?

Thank you,

blaylok
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refinery

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I am wondering if I am going to get scsi id conflicts because both computers will be on scsi id7? Can the internal Id of either machine be changed?
1. Yes
2. No, not with that SCSI card. Only card I know of that lets you change the Mac scsi ID are adaptec 39160 cards.
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DieHard

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The akai dd1000 has 2 x c50 scsi connection sockets but I am wondering if I am going to get scsi id conflicts because both computers will be on scsi id7? Can the internal Id of either machine be changed?

I don't have the manual, but normally (2) Ext SCSI connectors would mean 2 separate SCSI busses that terminate at the port and the last device in the external chain; but perhaps both ports simply ribbon-ed internally to the same spot on the logic board... which really makes 0 sense.

Mr Google says...
http://www.muzines.co.uk/articles/akai-dd1000/806
Quote
The rear panel has analogue inputs and outputs (balanced XLR) and MIDI sockets along with two SCSI ports (for the DL1000 remote control unit and an external optical drive respectively),

So I am wondering if only 1 port is a true SCSI port (the one for the optical drive), and the other is a proprietary 50 pin interface for the remote unit.  Just cause it's 50-pin does NOT mean it's SCSI.

Lastly, I would avoid hooking (2) Computer SCSI controllers to a single SCSI port without massive research.  Both controllers may be sending term power down the SCSI chain, which can give some undesired results, like SCSI ID reflections, device overshooting, etc.

This may help or hinder:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=1712.msg7846#msg7846

As a caveat, I may be 100% wrong in the situation :)
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refinery

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The akai dd1000 has 2 x c50 scsi connection sockets but I am wondering if I am going to get scsi id conflicts because both computers will be on scsi id7? Can the internal Id of either machine be changed?

I don't have the manual, but normally (2) Ext SCSI connectors would mean 2 separate SCSI busses that terminate at the port and the last device in the external chain; but perhaps both ports simply ribbon-ed internally to the same spot on the logic board... which really makes 0 sense.
 :)

This was pretty common with rack mount samplers... All Kurzweil rack samplers have two SCSI ports, whereas rack mount Emu Ultras typically had the cheaper option which was just an internal cable with a cn50 at the end connected to one of the expansion ports.
The idea was to provide flexibility with external drives, zip drives, and other devices where having the sampler at the very end was not always convenient.
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refinery

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Oh wow the plot thickens.
Looked up a picture of this thing and it actually has *three* SCSI connectors on back.
So my guess here is the "bottom" one is for computer interface and the other is probably for attaching other drives exclusively for the DD1000.
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ssp3

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IIRC, the top two are for connecting several DD1000's in a chain + remote. The bottom one is for connecting external supported SCSI drive.

(I owned one of these briefly around 201*? when I had an idea to set up a file transfer service to cover all possible formats - Adat, DA-88, Radar etc. Sold it to a DJ at the end who wanted to go back to late 80s production style a la Ben Liebrand).
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blaylok

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Thank you everyone for your advice and helpful answers,

After more Google I managed to find this French site dedicated to the Akai dd1000

http://dd1000.free.fr/scsi/dd1000.htm

In the SCSI section it says -

The DD1000 has three SCSI sockets: one SCSI-1 socket, and two SCSI-2 sockets.

Contrary to what one might think, these names do not define the SCSI standards used, but the SCSI bus number. The DD1000 therefore has 2 SCSI buses, to the SCSI-1 standard, and are used as follows:

The SCSI-1 socket is used to connect up to 5 external disk drives. But why 5? While SCSI-1 supports up to 7 devices? The explanation is simple: let's take the case where your DD1000 is connected to a MacIntosh, and to which you have connected 5 external disks. Now let's count the SCSI devices:
- the Macintosh
- the DD1000 (don't forget it!)
- the 5 disk drives.
That's a total of 7 devices!

The SCSI-2 sockets are used to connect the DL1000 (remote control) or a Macintoshâ„¢ which will serve as a remote control, using the DD-QMAC software.


To do this, you need to use a Centronics type scsi cable at both ends. Connect to the DD1000 on the one hand, then to your external scsi box on the other hand. We remind you that this operation must be carried out with the machines turned off .
Then position your scsi cap, to end the chain (in case you only have one reader, otherwise position it on the last element of the chain).
SCSI plug
 
Once this operation has been carried out, you must now specify to the DD1000 that your drive is external

So it seems as though there are indeed 2 x SCSI buses.

Thanks again everyone

blaylok
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refinery

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Sounds like problem solved then... OS9 machine to the SCSI2 Connection since it's running the software, and g4 to the SCSI2 Connection.

Gotta admit that sounds like a pretty cool setup. How are the converters on that thing?
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robespierre

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The original question was about connecting two computers to the recorder over the same SCSI bus.
The problem is that you can't normally connect two computers to one SCSI bus because they aren't expecting to share devices. The SCSI protocols that permit sharing (RESERVE and RELEASE) are not supported and so this will not work.
Additionally, every unit on a SCSI bus must have a unique SCSI ID, and the capability to change the computer's HBA from its default ID of 7 may not exist, so sharing a bus is again impossible.

When a PowerBook is connected to another computer in SCSI Target Disk Mode, "A unique system control panel on the PowerBook was used to select a non-conflicting SCSI ID number from the host Mac." From what I gather, it resets the ID to its default of 7 when booting to the Finder.
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blaylok

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Thanks again everyone

Yes problem solved  :)

Refinery - it is indeed a cool set up. I like it alot. The converters in the dd1ooo sound very smooth.

I have swapped out the noisy, old & loud mo drive and replaced it with an internal blueSCSI, it works very well.
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DieHard

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Most Excellent :)

SCSI rules.... 2 Busses makes way, way more sense
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IIO

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he converters in the dd1ooo sound very smooth.

it had the same PCM DAC which the s-1000 also had when i remember right.
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blaylok

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I am unsure if it the same PCM DAC as the s1000 sorry IIO
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