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General => Off Topic => Topic started by: DieHard on October 14, 2016, 11:05:00 AM
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OK... I hate to talk politics and I do not normally following the elections, but this year is different.
There am many reasons, too long to mention in this post, that the media is concerning me and I am very alarmed by the current regime's ability to control information on an unprecedented level; and here in America, I feel we need a change.
So... I am very interested in any views from friends around the world... what do you guys think of Trump and Hilary and why ?
Let's all remain friends... these are just opinions :)
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Let's all remain friends...
Good luck with that!! Haha! ;D
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The WHOLE thing is such a depressing circus! :'(
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This guy is probably the most honest guy I've seen run. He will tell you straight up that he will lie to you. (posting this as a funny item, even though the guy really does run).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7g6Ba0Uc9bM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7g6Ba0Uc9bM)
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the trump fence is estimated with 1 bill in tax money, dont think he will pay for it but bet on it he has already the companys who do the job so the money go straight into his account. that fucker means war. going back to iraq to take the oil is bull. cutting off the asians from the market will tear the country up because they want their debts paid in full. you looking at a total war .... china north korea the russians and the islamic countrys
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OK... I hate to talk politics
Why? If we like to make this world a better place we have to talk. Well I can understand that you don´t follow politicians, but politics is so much more!
So... I am very interested in any views from friends around the world... what do you guys think of Trump and Hilary and why ?
Hmm, well I am wondering what you "over there" are accepting in first place. This doesn´t feel like democracy. To me it is more a kind of a huge show. Always the same, no matter who is in the first line. The question of person x vs. person y should sidetrack all of you from the real problems.
No chance for a real change. None of the smaller candidates have any chance. President will become who works best for those who own. Sanders campaing will be the most "change" you´ll ever see. Nothing will happen. Or did you get the feeling something is moving, after we had the proove by Snowden?
Well I´d suggest to read more Chomsky, and don´t follow their game "x or y" ;)
Sad for the damned, who live in areas of gestategic interrests or with raw material deposits all over the world. Be it Ukraine, Syria, Pakistan, half Africa, ...
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So... I am very interested in any views from friends around the world... what do you guys think of Trump and Hilary and why ?
We don't see major differences about US being ruled by Democrats or Republicans. We only see differences about "foreign operations" being performed by CIA, Pentagon or other agencies, sometimes in opposite directions ... always causing damage to other countries.
I can show a bunch of examples of past and present operations of this kind.
Let's all remain friends... these are just opinions :)
Ofcourse we can remain being friends. The US government is just a comedy for the US citizens, because actually it only serve to big corporations. They only take care of the US people if they are focused by a camera lens, otherwise they are as disposable as other countries people .
Well I´d suggest to read more Chomsky, and don´t follow their game "x or y" ;)
You are right, I know about Chomsky ideas.
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So... I am very interested in any views from friends around the world... what do you guys think of Trump and Hilary and why ?
Hey this is very interesting to hear 'outside' views! Thanks and keep them coming! ;D
Nice idea DieHard. ;D
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The circus that we see here in the UK is the same as you see it in the US! I can't believe that out of a population of what, 300 million? These are the 2 people you are left to choose from!
As far as I'm concerned, the vote should go to whoever doesn't start World War 3! And at the moment, that looks like Trump! However, I'm not naive enough to think that your president is elected, I believe they are selected anyway, and that whoever gets in will in turn be run by a global puppet master shadow government.
The whole posturing, finger pointing, accusations, the stuff dragged up from the past 30 years... it's just entertainment!
Whatever happens I'm sure it'll overshadow any real news until the nukes start flying!
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I've been lobbying for a 'None of the Above' on the ballot. If 'None of the Above' gets more votes than either of the candidates then they have to start over with DIFFERENT candidates!! ;D ;D ;D
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well dont forget you dont get to vote the president actually
thats happening in d.c.
so what the hell is all that about
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Hey :),
I would have posted something earlier but there was to much work to do. I am a bit confused about the american "way" of voting. I read a lot these day's about the US elections, more or less because of the two big candidates...
Here in Germany you don't have to register to get to the polls. You will be registered when you get born. But thats not the problem. I know most countries do it that way. But maybe that way its easier.
The wired things about the US election system in my opinion are the following:
First, the constituency is set every 10 (?) years again by the actual politicians, to increase the chance to win... right? (I read this on wikipedia) :o
Second, every state has its own law/rule for the election. If there is a distribution of the election men e.g. 5 for candidate A and 6 for candidate B - Candidate B will receive all 11 votes. Isn't this a bit unfair for the 45% people which vote for A? :-X
Next, the electoral campaigns of the people who wants to get the office of presidency burns money - not a only a lot - an enormous amount of money. So, only rich people (or people who are supported by rich people) can become president?
And last, are you sure voting on computers is reliable? Isn't it relatively easy to "change" the results?! And how would you proof the results? I think its harder to fake an election when you make your tick on a sheet of paper.
Yes I want to stay friends with you :) Maybe I misunderstood something about this and you can clarify it. At least on one thing the situation for you in the US and for us in germany is the same - The choice you have is (from my point of view) like plague or cholera (I don't know if I have this saying in english too) ???
But what's realy important. All kind of people, in the US, here in germany and elsewhere are sad of the actuel politics. They rule for the rich and supress the normal people...
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Well, a point of view from France, for a change. However I'm a bit of an original. I'm not main stream.
I'm part of a small group, a small party (UPR if you ask) that is tired of the EU dictature ( a small group of non-elected people ruling over 500 millions people). What we aim, is what the Resistance dreamed of after 1945. Charles de Gaulle did a good part of it, but since it has been destroyed bit by bit. We do not have a money of our own, we do not have the control of our own laws, nor of peace or war. We have been inslaved by treaties the people have rejected (2005 referendum) and imposed by corrupted governants.
As we see things from here, Mrs Clinton is the candidate of Goldmann Sachs and we think we will better off with Mr. Trump. We have many good reasons for example to have good relation with Russia, and I'm afraid it's not what Clinton wants. We want the best for France, as I imagine you want the best for the USA. The best doesn't include a war, any war.
In France the media are 100% for Mrs Clinton, up the point it's kind of ridiculous. They are also 100% pro-UE. And It's not a coïncidence.
Genuine anti-EU leaders are censured: no TV, no media coverage, no wikipedia. It's very frustrating. M.Trump beeing elected could be a change in that. We'll see tomorrow.
It's odd that our fate in France might be decided in your country.
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Well, a point of view from France, for a change. However I'm a bit of an original. I'm not main stream.
I'm part of a small group, a small party (UPR if you ask) that is tired of the EU dictature ( a small group of non-elected people ruling over 500 millions people). What we aim, is what the Resistance dreamed of after 1945. Charles de Gaulle did a good part of it, but since it has been destroyed bit by bit. We do not have a money of our own, we do not have the control of our own laws, nor of peace or war. We have been inslaved by treaties the people have rejected (2005 referendum) and imposed by corrupted governants.
...
It's odd that our fate in France might be decided in your country.
If this happens to France, one of most powerful countries in Europe and the world. What do you expect for other countries?
Germany is a military colony of the US, UK is a US Trojan Horse , Italy and Spain aren't at its best, and the remaining countries as Ireland, Belgium, Netherlands, Austria, Poland etc ... simply aren't enough powerful to be free.
But together it's a real different history. "The power always return to Europe" as some historians said and nowadays that's an actual nightmare for the US.
I really understand some of the argues against the EU. But Europe should be united in this or other way.
Otherwise, we fall -even deeper-, including France, Germany and UK.
When I said US I'm refering only to US govern to the big companies service. Not the US people.
Most US citizens really will regret about his country If they know what they govern do to rest of the world.
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I did not think I would return here with Mr.Trump elected. Life is full of surprises.
I agree with MacTron that Europe is a great thing. It has produced great things, AirBus, Ariane, and many others.
But UE is not Europe. This confusion serves well the establishment. But it's a dictature always build against the people, not with the people.
UE has no respect for the people. And the people they despise the most today is you, the american people. The french newspapers are out of rage. You are described as selfish cowards, racist, and xenophobic (Le Monde), facist (Libération). No doubt they will soon suggest you to vote again.
My advise : let them know you can "Think Different".
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even bernie would have continued with opression, exploitation, imperialism and mass killing, and since that clown who "won" now has declared the election was fraud until ten minutes before it was clear he will win, i think so too now.
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I'm a right winger in most respects, particularly on the economy. I have my bone to pick with capitalism in the end but I'd rather have a meritocracy than more wealth redistribution. Trump got my vote for his tax proposals as I'm a businessman.
Trump is far from my personal ideal president, but the GOP in its entirety is even further.
I won't comment further as I'm positive I'd piss off every liberal on this forum ;)
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if i voted, it would be with a possible society in mind.
i realize most people will let their comfort vote for them..
being easy targets for those who make promises not to keep.
also, if the laws of the street gives the decision, why not vote with fists and firearms? shit has happened before, i am afraid.
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Trump is obviously the best choice right now for the US. Since he owes no alliance to the current powers in place, so we can finally have some corruption removed from both of our political parties which is very needed right now. That, in itself, is reason for celebration at the moment. He won with massive odds against him. The "George Soros" types are in total shock that they lost this one, and believe me, they put a massive amount of money up to kill the Trump movement. However, Trump was able to "grab America by the pussy" and hold on. Many Americans will be divided over this for a long time.
Our current Semi-Socialized Medicine (Obama-Care) was a disaster and will impact many who never wanted it, and now have to pay even if they opted out all together.
Well, back to work... glad it's over, hope small businesses like mine can survive, the pickings are slim... but at least I have a place to go in the AM :) I'll keep you guys posted on the effects of the Trump presidency here locally in CA.
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I'm reading you guys in CA are trying to secede due to Trump ;D
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If that happens maybe you guys can save a room for me
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First, the American people do not elect the President. Common misunderstanding here, amplified by the way said election is covered by the media.
What they do is elect the Electoral College. It is that group of people who elect the President. They meet on December 19th this year. The Electors are not legally bound to vote for the candidate that was the top vote getter in the state they represent, but they do traditionally. When they don't, they are called "Faithless Electors" and are subject to the laws of the state they represent.
The last time the Electoral College had Faithless Electors was in the election of 2000.
Second, as a member of a given minority (gay male) I am terrified at what I see just a few days after the Election of 11/08/16. A number of attacks on people of minority status, KKK rallies, white supremacist speeches, Redoubt sales (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Redoubt) for that, and other such items.
I have seen people attacked myself, just for being gay or lesbian. I have seen trans folks beaten on the street (I was in an elevator at the time), I have read how non-whites are being abused vocally and their proiperty defaced.
It is like Trump has sanctioned such behavior by saying he would dismantle same sex marriage and the like. He also has not condemned these horrific actions, giving tacit support to them. He seems to want to undo 20 years of human rights advances.
This is why, in liberal cities, you are seeing protests and riots. It is why you are seeing ballot measures gathering signatures for secession in Calfornia, Oregon, and Washington. It is why you are seeing pro-independence groups like Cascadia and Calexit being formed and growing in membership.
In no way do we want to return to those dark times.
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As we see things from here, Mrs Clinton is the candidate of Goldmann Sachs and we think we will better off with Mr. Trump.
and what do you think which bank is trump the cadidate of? does it make a difference which bank? :)
his first aim is to withdraw the recent financial market regulations - the rest he says is just for show.
In France the media are 100% for Mrs Clinton, up the point it's kind of ridiculous.
in germany we had a survey where 7% voted for trump and 53% for clinton.
this means that 60% of the germans still would vote for capitalism. so that they have something to complain about, which is a widespread hobby here across the whole policical spectrum.
what i find more interesting is that 6% of the böack US citizens also voted for trump. this probably means that 6% of all colored people are mentally deranged... :D
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In the UK, I was like "F**K TRUMP"
Don't get me wrong, I still think that & also the same to Hillary.
But Trump has mellowed as soon as he got it... he didn't slag Hillary off, he just congratulated her!
I wonder if he might actually turn out to be OK?
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I don't think he is being all that mellow to be honest. He appointed that alt-right Breitbart News head as his Chief Advisor. That brings in a white nationalist, anti-Jewish, anti-gay and bigoted man to the closest position of a president. Not to mention the appointment of the head of the Republican party.
Sigh. White power folks have been attacking people and churches all across the country.
I come from German immigrants who watched the National Socialists come to power. I come from a family that fought against the Russians in World War II and three uncles (Kurt, Gierhardt, and Georg) who died on that front. My grandparents helped with bombed refugees and manned bomb shelters. They watched the Jews be herded into Ghettos never to be heard from again, they knew of people whom the Gestapo came for, people who spent time in the camps or police cellars but would never speak about it when they were released. They serve as a warning to us all about what happens when the radical right take over government. It is important to note that Hitler also came to power legally through an appointment by President Hindenburg--just as Trump has been legally elected (assuming the Electoral College votes as they have for a century).
But I cannot just roll over and make nice with the half that voted the other way—the fact Trump was to destroy my marriage and his vice president wants to make it a crime to have a same sex marriage means I can in no way just roll over and be nice with that half. I have to be angry and fight to keep the rights that others take for granted. That means not just accepting the results, it means fighting with them. Both my husband Jason and I feel that we are being faced with the same battles we fought in the 1990s ad 2000s. During that particular war, we in no way accepted the opposite side and we did not just reconcile with them—we had to fight for two decades, both against them and against the system itself.
I do not know if anyone saw Episcopal Bishop Edgar Budde’s comments on one of his parish church’s vandalism episode, and how it was not the first and how anti-American it is. This is yet another reason to not just accept the results and make nice with everyone, as some folks are saying we have to do.
I could go on, but the fact Trump appointed Breitbart news head Stephen Branning as his chief strategist and senior counselor speaks volumes about his support of the alt right, white nationalism, and anti-Semitism. The protestors recognize these very feelings and facts, that is why we have had a week of nightly protests centered around a group called Portland Resistance--and why I am seriously going to join them.
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diehard, would you comment on torvan's posts?
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We are all intelligent people who can certainly validate our opinions. Right now is a time of uncertainty and division in the US that our media loves to feed on.
The fact that change is needed is felt by at least half US the population, but there is also a strong need for division to be squashed, minorities DO have rights in the US, BUT many undocumented people that enter the country in an illegal manner strain our system and then have the opinion that they have the rights of both the natural born citizens and those that worked so hard to obtain citizenship in the legal manner, they do NOT. Minorities, whether ethnic or sexual orientation, should have the same rights and non-minority citizens, that is NOT the argument that many have put forth in this election. The argument was to take care of a ALL citizens first, to put energy and jobs before the "George Soros" agenda, to eliminate the bad trade deals that have made so many politicians personally rich and take back the country.
To see them protest, and then to see the US keep known criminals here as "Sanctuary Cities" in exchange for the votes of these criminals endangers citizens and is a ridiculous argument. Holding hands and singing "Kumbaya" has basically lost popularity here over the last 8 years. Nationalism does NOT have to equate with "Natzism". Pride does NOT have to equate with minority bashing, and political correctness that defies logic and the protection of American Citizens is a fucking joke for those who have lost all they have from a system bends over backwards to socialistic values, and rewarding those who choose not to work and create a welfare state.
Just an opinion :) Now get back to creating music... I hate politics
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DH said it a lot nicer than I would have -afro-