Author Topic: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1  (Read 1028 times)

Offline Borgmac

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Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« on: August 18, 2022, 03:59:12 PM »
Hi,
I have a Quicksilver upgraded with a Rev B board and a Dual CPU card.
Using a SSD with some IDE to SATA adapter.
From time to time, I have a very high sizzle sound coming out of the speaker at startup, at the time that the first disk icon appears on the desktop. Duration is one second or will not stop.
It happened with OS 9.
I thought it was a hardware issue, but it looks more like a software problem.

Happen with internal speaker and Apple round speakers with internal speaker disconnected.
I have 4 partitions on the SSD, one with 10.4 Tiger, 2 with 2 different implementations of 9.2.1
Never happen with Tiger
Happened only once with 9.2.1 new
Happen almost every time with Z1 9.2.1 (international version)
I copied some sound extension from one partition to another, no change.

I am lost, what could create this sizzle sound?

This post in the hardware section is describing the same situation, but there was never an answer  :(
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,5517.msg40916.html#msg40916

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2022, 07:12:44 PM »
Hey Borgmac!

Of course we’d all love to hear a recorded sample of that sizzle…

And I’m going to go with all connections cleaning (again, we’re now often looking at tarnish and oxidation of contacts… everywhere). Even the simple wired earbuds on my iPhones act up if I haven’t used them for awhile / and plugging & un-plugging them repeatedly helps to remedy that situation (as plug contact then improves.

We know that OS 9 (varieties) are often more sensitive than OS X flavors in many respects AND then there’s also the possibility of “noise” within your home’s wiring system from various other electronic items / devices… not to mention fluorescent and even some LED fixtures. (“Line noise”.)

Perhaps your QS is just more sensitive lately?

Review any and all recent changes to your machine and the possibility of “outside interference”.

Any HAM / shortwave radio operators in your area? Does this happen at any particular time of day?

That’s all I got. ;)

Oh! And then there’s the matter of that recent solar activity…
https://www.spaceweatherlive.com/en/solar-activity.html

Offline GaryN

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2022, 11:31:16 PM »
Since it never happens in OSX but only in OS9, let's surmise it's software.

The very first step here is to startup OS9 - Shift key held down - for "Extensions OFF"
If the noise persists, skip to the last sentence. If no noise then you start looking for the naughty Extension.
There are a few different ways of doing that. I suggest:
Make a new set of half of the Extensions you now have active and start with that.
If noise, the bad one is in that set. If no noise, the bad one is in the other half.
Cut the bad 1/2-set in half the same way, test and repeat.
Keep dividing the bad set in half until you get down to the offender - it really doesn't take very long.
Give the sets names as you go along to keep them organized and do NOT delete the original set.

If that doesn't solve it, holler back and we'll try something else.

Offline IIO

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2022, 12:07:37 AM »
broken amplifier?
insert arbitrary signature here

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2022, 05:51:52 AM »
“From time to time, I have a very high sizzle sound coming out of the speaker at startup, at the time that the first disk icon appears on the desktop. Duration is one second or will not stop.”

Seems intermittent?
So the software decides to sometimes sizzle, sometimes not?
Only once in OS 9.2.1… and almost every time with Z1 9.2.2.

Pull the adapter and SSD and transfer them both intact to another Quicksilver to see if the sizzle also transfers.
(You still have more than one QS there?)
No sizzle? Then swap the CPU also, to the new machine in an attempt to replicate the sizzle.

If the sizzle transfers, then software. If not… "hardware".

OR, you might even try to reload or update Z1 9.2.1 (international version) to 9.2.2?
https://www.macintoshrepository.org/2605-mac-os-9-0-4-9-1-9-2-1-9-2-2-international-english-updaters.

“You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.” -B. Dylan

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2022, 07:39:36 AM »

Hey Borgmac!

Of course we’d all love to hear a recorded sample of that sizzle…

Hi FBz, good to exchange with you again.
OK, I knew someone would point that out. Knowing that I am French speaking, I was not sure of the wording.
After checking more thoroughly, I found this article, very good examples of different sounds defects.
https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/docs/voice/voice-quality/30141-symptoms.html#anc9
I would say that my sound is something like sizzling (but with a thick bacon  ;D), Hissing and Static.
Like when you connect a speaker live and you do not insert the plug quick enough.


And I’m going to go with all connections cleaning
OK, will try

Perhaps your QS is just more sensitive lately?

This has actually been for months, I was just too lazy to look seriously at it  :-[
« Last Edit: August 19, 2022, 08:01:16 AM by Borgmac »

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2022, 07:50:56 AM »
Since it never happens in OSX but only in OS9, let's surmise it's software.

The very first step here is to startup OS9 - Shift key held down - for "Extensions OFF"

How could I have missed that. 35 years working on Mac and I forgot the most obvious check and the Extensions Manager >:(
Too much working on Mac OS X...

Thanks to remind me of this one.

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2022, 07:58:03 AM »
“From time to time, I have a very high sizzle sound coming out of the speaker at startup, at the time that the first disk icon appears on the desktop. Duration is one second or will not stop.”

Seems intermittent?
So the software decides to sometimes sizzle, sometimes not?
Only once in OS 9.2.1… and almost every time with Z1 9.2.2.

Pull the adapter and SSD and transfer them both intact to another Quicksilver to see if the sizzle also transfers.
(You still have more than one QS there?)
No sizzle? Then swap the CPU also, to the new machine in an attempt to replicate the sizzle.

“You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.” -B. Dylan

Yeah, Yeah, I know what you mean, may be after all a hardware problem.  ::)



OR, you might even try to reload or update Z1 9.2.1 (international version) to 9.2.2?
https://www.macintoshrepository.org/2605-mac-os-9-0-4-9-1-9-2-1-9-2-2-international-english-updaters.

That was my next step actually, but I am going first to try the Extensions Manager (see answer to GaryN post)

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2022, 07:58:53 AM »
broken amplifier?

May be a hardware issue actually...
How could I check that?

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2022, 08:52:13 AM »
And here is the sound.
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6444.0;attach=10430
Any idea what could cause it?

Actually this time it did start while loading extensions and stop at the desktop display.
As usual , no sound anymore after that.
So the test of the extensions is next.

Offline IIO

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2022, 09:31:43 AM »
wow, hard to tell if it is caused on the analog or digital domain. :)
insert arbitrary signature here

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2022, 09:48:15 AM »
Have you anything plugged into the microphone jack?
Even if not (or ever) - blow some compressed air into that port
and maybe try plugging something in and out of it repeatedly
(with the machine powered off). Then reboot.

Do same plugging in and out for the sound out port. (And air too.)

Interested to know if it does same with "all extensions off" boot?

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2022, 10:20:46 AM »
Have you anything plugged into the microphone jack?
Even if not (or ever) - blow some compressed air into that port
and maybe try plugging something in and out of it repeatedly
(with the machine powered off). Then reboot.

Do same plugging in and out for the sound out port. (And air too.)

Interested to know if it does same with "all extensions off" boot?

Will try to clean the ports.
And YES, it did it with all extensions off  :(
Looks more of a hardware problem now.

I will nevertheless install a whole new 9.2.1 because the one that I am using is actually a copy of a copy of the partition I had on the original HD of that QuickSilver.
Let’s say 20 years old  ::)

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2022, 11:25:29 AM »
Ahh Borgmac…  :o

Living life on the edge - pushin’ that envelope.
A third generation copy, what could go wrong?

(Borgmac’s middle name is DANGER.)

Glad it’s likely not sunspots or solar flares! ;)

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2022, 08:16:55 AM »
Ahh Borgmac…  :o

Living life on the edge - pushin’ that envelope.
A third generation copy, what could go wrong?

OK, OK, believe it or not, I am installing right now Mac OS9 Z1 9.2.1 from the original disk that I had when buying this computer 20 years ago, you better be very careful, as usual >:(
OK, definitely going for a hardware problem, but better to start from a secured base.

Actually did some tests with all control Panels and Extensions and the internal speaker, as it did start up with working sound.
10 tests with Sinloon IDE SATA
10 tests with StartTech IDE SATA
Results are similar,
50% of the tests, sound OK
50% of the tests, hissing at desktop for one second. These 50% are not necessarily the same as above!
If you are interested, results attached.

I am going now to check these audio ports.
When I try to make some tests with the Apple Pro Speakers, computer hanged up several times.
Will come back later after hardware tests.

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2022, 07:15:19 PM »
What brand SSD are you using? Not that I suspect the SSD - but… maybe try an old conventional “spinner HD” to eliminate the SSD as a long-shot possible culprit?

Interesting to note that there’s no real difference between the StarTech and the Sinloon (for those that don’t know, the Sinloon is also known as our beloved “Bribge” adapter).

Next I’d check the speaker connection where the internal speaker connects to the mobo (although not likely to also cause sizzle / hiss with external speakers). And then of course the top and bottom of the sound out port on the mobo. All the “physical” hardware stuff.

Also likely that using headphones would also provide this noise as well… but I’d plug some in just to check.

Beyond the physical… time perhaps to get out that multi-meter and begin checking circuit. :(

Oh NO! Not that. ;)

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2022, 05:14:30 AM »
What brand SSD are you using? Not that I suspect the SSD - but… maybe try an old conventional “spinner HD” to eliminate the SSD as a long-shot possible culprit?
Intel SSD, old one that I have been using in that QS for a while.
Tried HD already, but with MacOS X only. No hiss, but should try with OS9 later.
For the time being I am checking for a hardware issue, speaker port was not very clean..

Next I’d check the speaker connection where the internal speaker connects to the mobo (although not likely to also cause sizzle / hiss with external speakers). And then of course the top and bottom of the sound out port on the mobo. All the “physical” hardware stuff.

Beyond the physical… time perhaps to get out that multi-meter and begin checking circuit. :(
Oh NO! Not that. ;)

Done already and YES, the multi-meter has been out yesterday, comparing the RevB mobo creating problems with my old QS 733.
Still ongoing.
Will try microphone also.

Offline IIO

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2022, 03:17:49 PM »
system components which have something to do with sound:

sound
appearance
quicktime settings & quicktime main component etension
speech manager
game sprockets
...

what happens when you attempt to change the volume while it occurs?
insert arbitrary signature here

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2022, 09:16:43 AM »
what happens when you attempt to change the volume while it occurs?
Good suggestion.
Actually, when playing with the volume setting bar in the Sound Control Panel, I can quite often get the sound back.
It does stay on, but if I try to change the volume setting, most of the time the sound disappear again.
Then after playing with the volume setting, get it back but I have to play sometime for a long time (20 seconds?)_
Does it ring a bell?

Regarding the system component, I have reinstalled a brand new OS 9.2.1, so I am considering it as being a problem of bad system component.
I still have sometime  a hiss at startup, but very seldom.

Offline Borgmac

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #19 on: August 22, 2022, 09:28:58 AM »
What brand SSD are you using? Not that I suspect the SSD - but… maybe try an old conventional “spinner HD” to eliminate the SSD as a long-shot possible culprit?

Interesting to note that there’s no real difference between the StarTech and the Sinloon (for those that don’t know, the Sinloon is also known as our beloved “Bribge” adapter).

Next I’d check the speaker connection where the internal speaker connects to the mobo (although not likely to also cause sizzle / hiss with external speakers). And then of course the top and bottom of the sound out port on the mobo. All the “physical” hardware stuff.

Also likely that using headphones would also provide this noise as well… but I’d plug some in just to check.

Beyond the physical… time perhaps to get out that multi-meter and begin checking circuit. :(

Oh NO! Not that. ;)

Back to basics!

Cleaning of the audio ports, where not very clean  ::)
Check the traces and continuity.
Nothing fancy except that I had some black oxydation on several round circles, the one going trough the mobo.
See attached picture. Clean everything but no improvement.
May be the sound through the internal speaker is more clear.

I reinstall on a mechanical Hitachi HD a brand new Mac OS Z1 9.2.1 from the original Quicksilver CD Rom.
Got a hiss at first start up and no sound.
After playing with the sound control panel volume bar, sound is coming back but I have to play sometime for a while (see my other post as reply to IIO.

Confirm that I never have the issue with Mac OS Tiger.

Offline FBz

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Re: Quicksilver sound sizzles in Mac OS 9.2.1
« Reply #20 on: August 22, 2022, 10:42:30 AM »
Back to OS 9 being a bit more “sensitive” and no issues with Tiger…

Are ALL mobo mounting screws sufficiently tight AND are all those metal surrounding contact surfaces clean and free of tarnish? Just something else to also check / address.



No other cards installed - except for the bare minimum for basic operation?

Think I’d try swapping out the mobo with another B board (or even an A board) just to see if the hiss follows with your CPU & SSD. If not, then it isn’t your OS 9 install… it’s something with (or on) that B board.

 


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