PowerBook Lombard 333mhz SSD

[SCSIJims]

Hi all. Thanks so much for all the help you all have offered me so far in my OS9 journey.
I tried everything I could think of before asking for help again.
If this is in a sticky and I missed it, please forgive.

SO, I am trying to install an ssd in a PowerBook Lombard. I opted for a known working msata chip: dogfish 128gb from the sticky. I used the following enclosure:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/mSATA-to-2-5-PATA-IDE-SSD-Enclosure-Adapter-Case-9-5mm-Solid-State-Drive-/151519954907?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

Hooked it up and loaded my os9.2 disk into my scsi cd drive, booted from the cd. Drive showed as “expansion bay - not supported.” The next thing I tried was installing os9.2 to the msata using my QS G4. Installed in PowerBook and still no go.

I did reinstall the original drive and confirm the problem is not with me digging around in the innards—it still works.

Can anyone recommend a confirmed working enclosure? Or could there be something else I’m missing?

One other item, since you’re reading—I want to replace the thermal pad and can’t find any info. Any Lombard users out there? Very few resources on the Lombard I’m surprised to find.

Again, thank you all for the support and thanks to anyone who took the time to read this. Happy computing.

[SCSIJims]

one bump before I give up on this project. I've tried everything I can think of.

[FBz]

Did you install a jumper on that enclosure to match that of the original drive?
(Master, Slave, etc.?) Or is a jumper even required?



I’ve a Lombard that’s never been opened but now I might, following your lead.
What did you use to format the SSD?
Does it need to be partitioned with the first 4 to 8 gigs dedicated for the OS?

I once wiped mine (6 GB HD) and IIRC…
had to install OS 9 - and then updates, to get it to 9.2.2.

If none of the above helps…
May open mine and attempt to use a SATA2IDE44VAO
adapter from this thread:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,5955.msg44447.html#msg44447
(if there is enough room inside the Lombard).

[FBz]

Answering my own question here:
there are no jumpers on the HD in this Lombard.

Will try the above mentioned adapter AND a *naked
SSD in the next day or so and report results.

*Not enough room for the adapter AND an SSD
in its' normal case... inside the Lombard.

[SCSIJims]

Hi, there! Thanks for looking into this!
I realized the drive (128gb) was too big, so I partitioned using my macbook air into 100gb and 28gb partitions then formatted each partition on the powerbook lombard. Disk manager still sees these partitions as "not supported." I tried adding the OS to one partition, then the other, then both with no luck. At one point, I actually got multi-boot to see the drive, but booting was unsuccessful.

I have 2x 128gb ssd's, tried the same on both. My enclosure, despite being ordered from the same listing seem to differ slightly--although it may be only cosmetic. I noticed the large capacitor is a different voltage, but that shouldn't matter I don't think. I'm about to return both enclosures and ssd's and try something new as the return windows are closing and a 100-120gb ssd would be more appropriate to see if partitioning is an issue. There are just too many variables!

While you're in there, do you think you might be able to measure the thickness of the thermal pad please? if you have calipers. I foolishly destroyed mine before doing so and was planning to replace with some arctic thermal padding I have left over from a mobo refurb.

[FBz]

May need to partition / format using your Lombard and an OS 9 (etc.) installer disc in order to install OS 9 drivers? But your QS should also have been capable of that. And it may all have something to do with the possible need for that ≤ 8 GB first partition? Before delving into this Lombard here any more today… have now seen other mentions of that 8 GB / first partition requirement - intended for the OS to reside. You might give that a go.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/lombard-ssd-booting-help.2293984/

Is this the thermal pad (red dot in pic)? Or does the daughter card need be removed? If it’s the white pad, it can’t be more than a sixteenth of an inch in thickness. (I don’t want to peel it off.)



I also need to remove that HD ribbon cable (yellow box) in order to remove the HD caddy to accommodate install of naked SSD and adapter. Method of removal? *Maybe the primary reason I don’t open laptops with my big, monkey-fisted fingers. 

Any of you other “Lombard-o-ites” can chime in here anytime. Don’t be shy.

[SCSIJims]

The first time that ribbon came off for me it was by accident, so it isn’t clipped in in any meaningful way. For me it came of by pulling the cable. If you want to be more careful than me (most people do) then I’d use a spudger or something plastic to lift the connector off the board.

[FBz]

More careful here but not quite as lucky. First attempt with the adapter and SSD - no boot. So I swapped the spinner HD back in and still no boot. (I also had not loaded the OS installer CD prior to first attempted SSD boot.) Took a very long break after numerous attempts. Thought I’d bricked it.

After break, carefully re-seated everything (again) and it then booted to spinner (sigh of relief). Inserted MacTron’s 9.2.2 Emergency disk, powered down, replaced the spinner w/ SSD and rebooted… thinking I’d format the 120 GB SSD into (3) 8 GB partitions and leave the balance to a 4th partition. But…

SSD that I was using had previously been formatted into 2 equal partitions on a Quicksilver using Drive Setup 2.1. and it already had OS 9.2.2 (for G4 Mac Mini) on one partition and Tiger on the other. Approximately 59 GB each. (There went that ≤ 8GB notion.) It booted from the Emergency disk and both partitions mounted. I chose the OS 9.2.2 partition and rebooted. No problem. (Didn’t try to boot Tiger.)

So I may reformat the SSD (within the Lombard) this weekend and re-install a fresh OS 9.2.2 from the Emergency disk (instead of the Mac Mini version) and see how that goes. Might even try the different IDE44-SATA22F adapter to leave the preferred SATA2IDE44VAO adapter for the Mac Minis.

*When I first booted to the spinner and then removed it, it was very hot (after short amount of runtime). This Lombard is going to love the cooler SSD… especially as its’ fan isn’t working. (Always something.) One thing I did notice was that the HD cable pin sockets allow the pins of the adapter to push them out a little bit, I intentionally pushed them all back in flush.

You might also check “small print instructions” for your enclosure to see if it just might require a jumper. The Ableconn mSATA SSD-IDE sleds we tested back in 2018 for G4 Mac Mini DID require a jumper in some instances. (And I almost missed these instructions back then.) Might be worth testing those variables with your enclosure(?).

[SCSIJims]

I went ahead and returned my msata's and enclosures after seeing the naked ssd solution. There were no instructions an I tried a jumped...the weird part is I've seen them used on Pismo's on youtube.
SO, I am going to try to replicate your solution as closely as possible.
Is this the adapter you used?
https://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Laptop-Drive-Female-Convert/dp/B085DJD9SQ/ref=asc_df_B085DJD9SQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=475789631743&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=4498662969356345684&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9059726&hvtargid=pla-1006727886225&psc=1

Thanks so much, I was about to give up entirely after trying 2 enclosures and 2 ssd's AND a set of 2x 256mb RAM from Memory Masters that was only recognized as 128.

[FBz]

No. The adapter I used was originally tested “best” for the G4 Mac Mini.
It’s more of an all-flat, in-line orientation instead of that “L” sort (like the one you linked).

The SATA2IDE44VAO (AS331 V1.5) was sourced from:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/302898697852?hash=item46862b567c:g:HMoAAOSwHTlbqzQt
AND they’ve now reduced the price a bit… and w/ free shipping too.

Just wiped and reformatted that naked [ Inland 128 GB SSD / yielded (2) 59 GB partitions] in the Lombard and attempted to install OS 9.2.2 (Mactron’s Emergency & Disk Repair file) a couple of times in the Lombard. It tried but froze during the 3 attempts so I took the SSD downstairs and did it all in a Quicksilver (w/ a 40 pin adapter). Just brought the SSD back upstairs and into the Lombard. Booted fine - even with OS 9.2.2 on a 59 GB partition.

I always blame the Lombard’s 24X CD-ROM drive.

And now I also understand that the Lombard’s fan (reportedly) rarely spins up - so mine might actually be working? AND that pad & heatsink arrangement just doesn’t seem right. The Motorola chip is actually on the bottom side, opposite right corner and it’s “bare”. I doubt that even a little thicker pad would have much different effect. (Might even be better.) It all just gets H-O-T!!!

*Oh yeah, and I tried to boot from Tiger partition while it was still there and it really tried… but no-go. (Panther 10.3.9 is the limit - which I may eventually install on the other, second 59 GB partition.)

[SCSIJims]

It works!! Used the recommended adapter and a naked inland 128gb. My quicksilver was misbehaving and wouldn’t let me keep the split partition, but it worked anyway!

119.23 bootable ssd running os 9.2.2.

Here are the steps I followed (thanks to FdB/FBz!!!!)
1. Install inland professional (P/N: 128GMB) in the quicksilver using sata to ide bridge.
2. Boot from 9.2.2 installer disk.
3. Format inland ssd from drive utility.
4. Install os 9 to ssd.
5. Remove from quicksilver, strip casing, and install in Lombard using the recommended mini ide to sata bridge.

Thank you thank you thank you!!!
I was so bummed out I couldn’t get this working.

Going to use some leftover thermal pad from my intel motherboard refurb to replace the old thermal tape.

Only thing left is RAM. Can anyone recommend a working model for 2x 256mb? The ones I bought from memory masters didn’t work.

Thanks again! Love this forum!

[SCSIJims]

Have to share the beauty (attached!) I used standoffs to attach the naked ssd to the mounting case…an open face sandwich?
Still looking for ram recommendations if anyone has one!

[SCSIJims]

UPDATE: Everything starts out well, but when I try to copy files from my usb stick, the system crashes. This usb stick is what I use to transfer files to my QS G4, so I know it is OS9 friendly.
Here's what I tried:
All peripherals disconnected. Running on A/C power (no battery).
1. Plug in USB stick, transfer 50mb file--total freeze partial way into the transfer. I thought maybe since there is only 128mb RAM (more on the way) this may be cutting a little close considering the OS takes up 30-something megs. Hard boot...not responding to pressing the button, have to pull the plug.
2. Plug in USB stick, transfer 20kb file--no problem! Moving to 3 without reboot.
3. Transfer of 5mb file--total freeze up, have to pull the plug again...
4. Reboot and freeze on desktop without doing anything ((((

My PRAM battery is bad. Can't find a replacement. Could this be the issue??

What is happening?! Lombard is a puzzler.

[FBz]

Oh big surprise here too, just now!

I tried same and got the same lock-up (at first). Ran “Disk First Aid / Verify” on two of the USB sticks normally used here with G3’s and both reported B-Tree errors (among other things). Chose then to “Repair” them both and now problem seems to be solved.

So I’d recommend running Disk First Aid - “Verify & Repair” on your stick. (These are USB v 2.1.1)

And this Lombard only has 128 MB of RAM too and the PRAM battery has been dead a long time.
It’s now just finishing up a very slow copy of 663 MB’s. But it worked w/o fail. G’ luck.

[SCSIJims]

Oh big surprise here too, just now!

I tried same and got the same lock-up (at first). Ran “Disk First Aid / Verify” on two of the USB sticks normally used here with G3’s and both reported B-Tree errors (among other things). Chose then to “Repair” them both and now problem seems to be solved.

So I’d recommend running Disk First Aid - “Verify & Repair” on your stick. (These are USB v 2.1.1)

And this Lombard only has 128 MB of RAM too and the PRAM battery has been dead a long time.
It’s now just finishing up a very slow copy of 663 MB’s. But it worked w/o fail. G’ luck.

INVALID B-TREE ERROR ON MY USB DRIVE HOLY COW.
Unfortunately, looks like the repair was unsuccessful as it is coming up after 2 passes of repair--froze the computer up again.
I suppose the problem could be my generic microcenter flash drives?? Worked fine on modern systems--perhaps they are more forgiving.
Maybe I should opt for something like sandisk or kingston...
I will continue testing options tomorrow! Thanks so much, FBz.

[starmax]

Just ordered one of these off eBay so hopefully I'll be up and running soon.  I had previously tried to use the same IDE to m.2 SATA adapter that worked great in my Ti book, but it doesn't work in the Lombard.

Also, for those looking for more RAM, I just bought 512MB from this vendor:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/154471366571

I have bought lots of legacy RAM from them in the past, all worked perfectly.

[DieHard]

Is this the thermal pad (red dot in pic)? Or does the daughter card need be removed? If it’s the white pad, it can’t be more than a sixteenth of an inch in thickness. (I don’t want to peel it off.)

Just an FYI, yes, that is a thermal pad that transfers heat to the Aluminum plate above the CPU board,
DO NOT run the unit for more than a minute when testing scenarios without the plate in place, or you will eventually heat damage the CPU board.

[starmax]

So I received the IDE to SATA converter recommended above (eBay), and installed on a ADATA SSD.  OS9 works amazingly well, but I cannot get OSX to install.  The DVD spins up, spins down, up, down...  So I threw it into my Mystic G4 and installed Panther.  After re-installing into my lombard, I just get a spinning wheel on startup...  Done this several times now, but results are the same.  Today, I put an old OWC SATA-2 SSD in, and tried the same.  Booted into Darwin initially, but after a couple reboots, eventually I got into OSX.  Everything seems slow...    Pretty sure I have an Inland SSD around here somewhere, I will see if I can track it down.

In the meantime, I modified my CPU's heatsink (hoping to overclock my 400/66 to 466/83 eventually).  The stock one literally is plastic...  what a joke.  I removed a northbridge heat spreader from a dead MacBook pro logic board, applied some thermal paste and a new thermal pad on top of it and put it all back together.  Seems to be working well, the entire laptop cage is pretty hot.  Fan still not coming on though, but I'm pretty sure I heard it spin up last week, so I don't think it's dead.  Will snap a picture later once I have it apart again.

*Images resized. / FdB

[starmax]

Well I found my Inland SSD in an old Mac Mini, transplanted it into my Mystic, installed Panther, popped it into my Lombard and it still hangs on startup.  Wondering if OSX has to be installed within the first 8GB of the first partition, similar to the first Gen iMacs?  What are you guys using for a partition scheme?

Thanks!!

[FBz]

2 equal partitions of ~59 GB each on a 128 GB naked SSD.
1st partition for OS 9 and the 2nd for Panther.

After several attempts, placed it into a Quicksilver and installed Panther.
Loooong boot sequence here due likely to only 128 mb of RAM.
(Takes forever to boot Panther with just 128 mb RAM.)