Two G4 machines; ready to shoot them, myself or all three

[Rainier]

I have a G4 Mini and a MDD fw400 dual CPU.
Both run. Sometimes. For awhile. Frequently a short while.
Mouse locks up. Screen locks up. Sometimes both. Sometimes at boot. Sometimes in the middle of a project.
Neither will network to OS X, except for FTP. Neither can reach the internet, although one has a direct ethernet connection to the router.
I've scoured this site and a few others, trying various suggestions and solutions.. I've reinstalled OS9 more times than I can count, both machines.
I've invested hours and dollars and I'm about ready to toss them both in the trash.
Is it possible to get a stable OS9 machine working?
OH, Apple's hardware diagnostic app, which I have for the MDD, refuses to run from three different CDs I've burned.

Can someone talk me down?

[GaryN]

I have a G4 Mini and a MDD fw400 dual CPU.
Both run. Sometimes. For awhile. Frequently a short while.
Mouse locks up. Screen locks up. Sometimes both. Sometimes at boot. Sometimes in the middle of a project.

These freezes are not the OS. I've run an MDD daily for years without the issues you're having.
You need to describe what you're doing: What software is freezing, what kind of projects? Details count.

Neither will network to OS X, except for FTP.

That's correct. They won't directly network… at least not without a 3rd-party solution like Netatalk and another computer to act as a file server.
OSX can "see" OS9 easily. OS9 can't "see" OSX so well because OSX didn't yet exist when OS9 was written.

EXAMPLE: I record stuff in OS9. I sometimes kick it to OSX for want of some function or plugin that didn't exist in OS9.
I have a dual-boot MDD (OS9 & 10.5) I just reboot to OSX, fetch the file, work on it, kick it back to the OS9 drive and reboot OS9. No big deal.

Neither can reach the internet, although one has a direct ethernet connection to the router.

A direct Ethernet line IS the best way to get OS9 on the internet. The migraine-inducing experience once you're ON the net with it is something else entirely.
You must have these extensions enabled:
Apple Enet
Apple Enet Support
Open Transport (should be v 2.8.1)
Open Transport ASLM Modules
Open Transport Serial Arbitrator  (depending on what it is you're doing, using serial ports etc. - better on than off generally)

and this Control Panel:
TCP/IP (2.8.1)… that should be set:
* Connect via Ethernet
* Configure using DHCP
Options button: TCP/IP Active
Search Domains: Depends on your ISP…… Look at what is there in OSX and type it in.

That should convince your ISP to issue an address to the computer and get it up.

WireLESS connection is a different bag of worms best addressed with an Ethernet-to-WiFi bridge because OS9 can't operate under modern WiFi encryption.

I've scoured this site and a few others, trying various suggestions and solutions.. I've reinstalled OS9 more times than I can count, both machines.
I've invested hours and dollars and I'm about ready to toss them both in the trash.
Is it possible to get a stable OS9 machine working?

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again hoping for a different result.
I repeat: Details. What software etc. Your problems are virtually certain to NOT be the OS.

OH, Apple's hardware diagnostic app, which I have for the MDD, refuses to run from three different CDs I've burned.

Define "refuses to run" Can you burn anything else (even just itunes tracks or such) and run it/play them?
What exactly happens when you try to run Hardware Test? You know it has to be the exact correct version for the machine under test…

Can someone talk me down?

Hope this helps. Please don't shoot anything or yourself. The Forum exists to prevent suicides after all.

[DieHard]

OH, Apple's hardware diagnostic app, which I have for the MDD, refuses to run from three different CDs I've burned.

Until you get a hardware diag to run and pass, all bets are off, Bad RAM will cause frequent "freezing" at random times. so it's best to remove ALL sticks, clean the edges with electric contact cleaner (from any auto parts store) put them in one at a time to run an extended RAM test; this will take a LONG time, so don't stare at it, do other things and let it run, then come back and go to the next stick, of course, remove the power plug while changing sticks.  This extended testing nightmare is the only way to track down intermittent issues, especially with RAM.  If a stick will not even complete the test with an error, then it is most likely shot (or a logic board issue), so go to the next one.

After each stick is tested individually, then install all of them and do another extended test
This last step ensures you don't have a bad ram slot on the board (more common than you would think)

Also, as far as I remember, this version 1.2.6 should do both QS and MDD models:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,818.0.html

Where, this one is MDD only (1.2.7):
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,822.0.html

Also, as a side note, apple hard drives can be tested in a PC tower without loosing any data.
This program, WD Lifeguard
https://support.wdc.com/downloads.aspx?lang=en&p=3

Will test all PATA/SATA Hard drives (even non-Western Digital) brands

[Mat]

RAM was also the first thing I thought about. Follow DieHards advice. In the end it has to be the RAM or the board. You could also check your capacitors at the board and see if no one of them trickles out.

I have one G4 with installed "Giga Designs G-Celerator G4/1.4 GHz" that behaves similar under 9.2.2 and had no problems when the previous owner used it with X, … extremely frustrating. Finally I think Giga Designs is not really 9-compatible.

[Hopfenholz]

Hard freezing does sound like the RAM.

We are here for you :-)

Regarding network, take an Ethernet cable, connect the 2 OS 9 macs together. Go to AppleTalk control panel, set to connect via Ethernet, turn AppleTalk off, save, then on, then save, turn File Sharing on via the appropriate control panel.

Go to the Chooser, click on the AppleShare icon. Can you see the other mac in the Chooser window as a file share?

You don’t even need a hub to try this, at least on my TiBook and Pismo.

Joel

[FBz]

There are a great many suggestions already offered here…
and I’d suggest everyone read Ranier’s previous 8 posts, first.

[Rainier]

Well, I've climbed back in, off the ledge, and tucked the illusory hand gun (something I don't own) behind some dusty tomes on the bookshelf.
So I'm back on the ground again, attitude slightly adjusted, feeling curious again to suss out these two machines.
Thanks, all, for your kind words and concrete counsel. I'll start with the basics and attempt to diagnose the two, starting with the MDD and its RAM.
(As to previous posts: the Mini was giving me persistent mouse freezes. I went to a bona fide Apple mouse without much success. Found a Logitech roller worked pretty well without locking up. The Mini has more stability than the MDD, but less than I would like.
I'll keep at it; many thanks...

[Greystash]

I get the mouse freezing all the time, and I believe this is due to OS9 running on unsupported hardware. I've only ever experienced it with the unsupported PBG4s, and my recently acquired Mac Mini 1.42Ghz. To resolve this all I do is reset the machine (command + control + power) and keep moving the mouse as it boots, then it's fine. It's annoying but not annoying enough for me to have really looked into it yet. Never experienced this on a machine designed to run OS9.

[Syntho]

Years back when I was new to the classic Macs, I had an MDD that froze for no apparent reason. Moving the mouse would freeze it even. In fact, when I used the mouse, I could hear a noticeable change in the fan speed 

After months of fooling with it, buying other Macs that ended up having issues too, and not to mention literally having scarred-up bloody fingers after screwing with all of them, I moved to pre-USB Macs and have been there ever since. Rock solid since then.

I don’t have any advice unless what you take from this is to switch to another Mac, but I do feel your pain. LITERALLY.

DieHard gave me a QS later on, and I have to admit, it’s worked flawlessly when I needed it. Sometimes some of these Macs, no matter what you do, they just don’t want to work normally. It was a matter of finding a good working one for me.

[Rainier]

Syntho et al
I'm not there yet. I do like OS9 when it works. And FrameMaker 7 on OS9 beats the newer windoze only FrameMaker versions, IMHO, so I want to get things stable and functioning. (Re the IMHO. My wife says I've never had a humble opinion in my life...)
So shifting to an earlier permutation is attractive 'cause it's fun messing around and sorting stuff out. But I'm invested in many ways in the Mini and the MDD and I want to exhaust them—or me—whichever happens first, first.
Of course since the new year I've had little time to futz with either machine.
I'll pull the RAM and give a good cleaning then compressed air on the RAM slots. Next I'll try to figure how to get the AHT running from a CD. I'd do it the other way, but cleaning RAM is simple; figuring how to get AHT to work requires aspirin.

Thanks, all of you.