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[part12studios]

Hi everyone, I have some 3DO game console images that i need to burn.  I could do with burn for OSX but OSX Burn so far as i could find won't run under OSX Leopard. 

Looking for 10.9 or newer.  I've emailed them to see if they have legacy versions somewhere, however after trying Toast Titanium 5.3 I found it didn't seem to offer a way to read a cue file.  it just wants to make data, music or video disks.

Is there another recommended burning software package out there that anyone knows will recognize .cue / .bin files? 

Thanks,
Caleb

[ssp3]

Re. Burn - just go there and download whichever version you want:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/burn-osx/files/Burn/

2.5.1 should be OK for Leopard.

As to the bin/cue files - it sounds like you want to burn a DDP. Is it so?

[ssp3]

Oops, .cue is not a file from the DDP file set, so forget what I wrote about the DDP.
What is it that you want to burn?

[IIO]

toast normally opens cue/bin, as the document type is as old as CD-R burning itself. if it is a format which can be understood by the system it can also be mounted and if it a VCD it will also directly in VLC in OSX.

what does the cue say? (open in text edit)

[part12studios]

thank you!  @ssp3 i got reply from the creator and shared the link to that 2.5.1 so thank you for that suggestion.  i didn't know where to find download history of versions.  The author had shared that while he had OS9 dev experience, burn was OSX only so that's good to know.  I'm going to give it a try tonight.

Also anyone have any suggestions of best quality CD-R?  I must admit the disks i'm burning to concern me because i dunno, they seem like they are so think blank i can see through them already.. i seem to remember CD-Rs being not sooo translucent..  in fact when burned surprisingly i couldn't even really see the burned area from the unburned..  the image i was burning was only 350mb or so.. but the whole disk looked consistent in pattern.. and i'd even say maybe it didn't burn but the disk did play

I just knew something was wrong because all of the burned disks you could tell the poor 3DO was having to re-read a number of tracks because i assume it was having trouble making out the data.. while normal disks operated fine telling me the CD drive is ok.

Some of the 3DO files come with some extra files i'm not familiar with.   .sub .ccd as well as the .cue and .img file..    i actually don't think any of these zips come with .bin files exactly.. but i imagine the .img file is the ame since that's the file with the data.

yea @ IIO that surprised me too.. that's why i used toast..  but when i'd go to "file / open" and point to the folder with the .cue file in it, it didn't give me any files it recognized as openable.

I checked all the options in the program and nothing made me feel very confident i wasn't going to just burn a CD with the .cue in it..   in the data section if i add files .cue .img, etc.. it felt more like it's just going to burn the CD with those files in it, not actually make it an image. 

I don't know what DDP is @SSP3, but yea basically i want to burn these zip files https://archive.org/download/Panasonic-3DO-Redump.org-2019-05-14 to CD-R and do it at the slowest burn rate possible (currently all my mordern hardware only goes down to x10) so I was exploring my Quicksilver and even Sawtooth superdrive options.  I might also have a SCSI CD Burner in my external SCSI CD Rom ranks (only used to read till now, never burn) as I know those would burn at those speeds because their max read time is x4.. heh. 

I'll try that older version of burn tonight. 

Thanks!
Caleb

[IIO]

maybe my memory is failing me and it only works in OSX. (myself i use toast 6/8/10 in OSX and not v5.x)

if you have windows around, there are various free tools such as bin2iso something which makes this a bit easier.

[ssp3]

Those 3DO image files are a tough cookie. Apparently Panasonic used their own file system, so copying/burning them should be similar to working with Akai sample CDs or Playstation stuff. Also, they won't mount under Mac OS.
I downloaded one of the .bin/.cue combos just for kicks and here are the results:
1. AnyToISO utility (OSX) recognised the .bin file but was unable to convert it to ISO.
2. Toast 9 under OSX recognised both files.
3. Toast 5.2.3 under OS9 did not recognise any of the files.
4. Toast 4.1.3 did see the .bin file (see attached), but ignored .cue file.
Judging by the .cue file, which is just a text file, btw, the discs have 2352 byte sector size, which was correctly identified by Toast 4.
I'd say give it a go and to try to burn a CD with Toast 4.

P.S. DDP = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disc_Description_Protocol

[part12studios]

interesting. that makes a lot of sense.. that the burning wasn't so much the issue but the packet sizes being not consistent making the 3DO have to re-read a lot of information.  I'll try Toast 4 for sure!   It does look like my Super Drive will go as low as x4 burning on  Quicksilver so that's a double benifit.  The main thing now is to convert all of these .img files to .bin because it seems like all of the 3DO files were zip as cue/img files

I'll report back with news.  Thankfully i don't have a lot of games to burn but i definitely have some missing games from my original collection that were due to loss/damage. 

Thanks!
Caleb

[part12studios]

Also i did try out Burn 2.5.1 however when running on leopard and with the SuperDrive at x4 or x8 (only options) disks that did burn under latest OSX Burn failed to write under 2.5.1 for whatever reason so that solution won't work.

Toast 4 it is! 

[part12studios]

having a heck of a time trying to convert .img files to .bin   so far powerISO and anyburn won't do it.. maybe because it's a 3DO image. 

So the recommendation is to try Toast 4 to burn it?   Fortunately I do have a powerbook 190 and SCSI adapter and a x4 SCSI CD Burner..  so with a little luck it all will "just work". 

BONUS QUESTION: could a G3 powerbook be "downgraded" to run OS 7.5?    I have a OS 8 G3 Powerbook and wonder if it would support older OS but it's not 68k tech..   Toast 4 seems to be 68k designed.. 

I also do have the Mac SE, but the floppy drive is sick (hoping to fix it this coming weekend)

Thanks!
Caleb

[ssp3]

.

[ssp3]

having a heck of a time trying to convert .img files to .bin   so far powerISO and anyburn won't do it.. maybe because it's a 3DO image.

Are you sure you need to convert it? Just point Toast 4 to the image file and see what it says. (Which file in the archive is it, btw?)

..could a G3 powerbook be "downgraded" to run OS 7.5?

No. Everything that came from Apple with G3 processor requires OS8 and up.

Toast 4 seems to be 68k designed..

Almost all apps of that era contain 68k code, so what?

[part12studios]

so PPC could run 68k software ok?  I was concerned maybe 68k software would not be compatible with PPC..

Ok cool about img and toast 4.. wasn't sure as it just seems like i've had zero luck finding any software for mac or pc at this point that likes the .img files i give them.  maybe it's not that it's .img, but that it's a 3DO .img? 

[adespoton]

The whole point of the PPC was that it could run all the old 68k software plus newer stuff optimized for the Power architecture.  Most 68k software works just fine on PPC.

As for bin/cue vs cue/img vs img/ccd/sub etc....

The bin section is a bit for bit representation of the data on the data tracks of the CD.  The cue file is a text file that describes the layout of the CD, so any software attempting to read the CD knows what format the tracks are in, what gap (if any) is between the tracks, what sector size is used, where the tracks are located in the data stream, etc.

img is essentially cue/bin in the same file; it's got a header at the top of the file, followed by the binary data.  The sub file contains extra data found inside tracks (useful for when a track intentionally had bad blocks for copy protection, the sub will cause them to be skipped), and the ccd file is a configuration file for the Windows CloneCD software, so it knows when the image was written, what's on it, etc.

So most versions of Toast will look at a file, check if it's got a header (either img-style or iso-9660/High Sierra style) and skip past it, looking for the actual CD magic bytes.  If it finds the magic bytes, it'll burn the CD with best-guess as to sector size -- potentially pulling that data from the header if it can find it.

Any CDs with regular sector formatting should burn just fine; if you've got one with multiple sessions, tracks with different sector sizes, or other odd characteristics, it may not burn correctly with Toast.  Any software that will burn from a cue file should be able to make a perfect copy, unless there's copy protection on the original, in which case you need burning software that understands sub files.

[IIO]

So the recommendation is to try Toast 4 to burn it?

yes, that is still the reconmendation i guess. when ssp3 says it seems to work for him, that should be the easiest solution.

unless you want to keep the images on HD too or free yourself from the depency of T4 for some reason. in that case go on finding a solution how to do the bin2iso thing.

[part12studios]

yea i'll go that route for sure.  Definitely not questioning what folks are suggesting, just making sure I understand what i need if i don't have the right stuff. 

I was kinda hoping i could find a PC Compatible old USB external drive for cheap, but they seem to be pretty non existent (something old enough that could go down to x4) on ebay from my initial search.. 

Have to see if i can find an external usb / ide case..  i have SCSI drives but that's a whole other mess for PC option that.. well dang.. i do have a windows 95 box and an adaptect SCSI card.. maybe i can find an option there.. 

@adespoton thanks for that awesome breakdown.  most of the 3do files do not have sub and such, but some do.. so i'll do some more digging around.  check with the emulation / 3do community and see if they have a suggested program (mac or otherwise). 

Thanks!
Caleb

[adespoton]

I just realized I said one thing that may be misleading.  CDs store the CD index at the end of the data track, so disk images have the CD index stored at the end of the file.  This is what Toast looks for.

[IIO]

i will download one too now. it is hard to believe that T5 can not read somthing which worked in T4.

[IIO]

so... works for me using toast 512.

[IIO]

no wait, 620 mb should be more than 8 minutes