Author Topic: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display  (Read 7606 times)

Offline AdmiralBrannigan

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Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« on: September 25, 2019, 08:56:38 PM »
Hi Everyone!
I am currently running a Mac Mini G4 1.25 with a 24" Cinema Display that came with my PowerMac G5. I installed OS 9.2 on the machine connected to my TV over VGA with the DVI to VGA adapter but when I switch it to my Cinema Display over DVI I get no picture. Had anyone else tried this Mac/Monitor combo? If so, what did you do to get it to work? Any help would be appreciated.

Offline IIO

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2019, 10:55:06 PM »
the polycarbonate cinema display was digital only (DVI-D) afaik.
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline AdmiralBrannigan

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2019, 10:25:24 PM »
Does that mean OS 9.2 doesn’t support it? The monitor works fine when running OS X, just not in the OS 9.2 install on the same machine.

Offline GaryN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2019, 12:03:23 AM »
Does that mean OS 9.2 doesn’t support it? The monitor works fine when running OS X, just not in the OS 9.2 install on the same machine.
Thoughts……
*The above is a clear indication of a compatible, working monitor. It is 100% supported in OS9.
*Booting the unit in OSX with the Cinema connected over DVI yields a picture.
*You should be able to then option-boot to OS9 and get the same picture without a problem.
*At boot, the video driver detects (with a protocol over DVI) what kind and size of display is connected and adjusts accordingly.
*If (guesswork here) OS9 is "stuck" somehow expecting to see an analog monitor because of the previous use of the VGA adapter, it might explain why there's no pic - however, that's NOT supposed to happen.
* There IS something and you WILL eventually find what's wrong - because that monitor absolutely should work.

Oh… solutions? Sorry… just thoughts. Maybe they'll help.


Offline IIO

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2019, 12:16:28 AM »
Does that mean OS 9.2 doesn’t support it?

no, but it could have been that the graphics card doesnt support DVI digital.

according to the specs of this card, with DVI analog it is limited to a clock of 130 mhz - which is a lower limit that when using VGA. this is in most cases the problem with bigger LCD screens on G4s.

and dont forget that as for the mac mini, the graphicis card driver is not from apple but from this forum. :)
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline ELN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2019, 07:43:38 PM »
Working on this problem.

Try the machine-specific version of 10.3 that shipped with this machine. Does that work? The answer could direct my efforts quite a bit.

Offline AdmiralBrannigan

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2019, 01:21:45 PM »
Yes, I have the OS X cds that came with the machine that version works fine with the monitor.

Offline GaryN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2019, 04:39:15 PM »
I am currently running a Mac Mini G4 1.25 with a 24" Cinema Display that came with my PowerMac G5.
I think we just might be making assumptions based on less-than-perfectly-clear communications…

Exactly which Cinema display "came with" your G5? Is it the clear polycarbonate one OR the slightly later aluminum pedestal one?

How about the exact model # ? It's in veeeery fine print on the back.

Offline AdmiralBrannigan

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2019, 07:01:18 PM »
It is the Aluminum one. Model Number: A1082

Offline GaryN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2019, 03:06:26 PM »
OK. Again, no good reason for that NOT to work.

Try this:

* Boot OS9 with the VGA just to make sure it comes up and runs properly.
* Shut down; reconnect via DVI and boot OSX. Open display prefs and note what it says. Verify it "knows" it's a Cinema display.
* Set startup prefs for OS9.
* Reboot. Note ANYthing that appears…it may be important later. If no pic…
* Reboot with shift held down for no extensions;  If no pic…
* Reboot with Command-V held down for verbose mode. Grab your phone and take pics of the text that appears, you may need to reboot and take more than one to get it all (or shoot rapid-fire). If NO text appears holler back. If text appears, holler back and attach the pics.


Offline AdmiralBrannigan

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2019, 07:46:30 PM »
Sorry, I am just getting back to this.

I booted to OS9 with VGA on another monitor and it came up fine.
I shut down and booted to OSX on DVI and it displayed fine.
I booted back to OS9 on DVI and noted that it would display to the point of the "Happy Mac" icon and then go blank.
I rebooted holding shift and got the same results with the "Happy Mac" and then it went blank.
I rebooted with Command-V and the results were also the same with the "Happy Mac" then it went blank. No text appeared.

Offline Knezzen

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2019, 11:12:22 PM »
Sorry, I am just getting back to this.

I booted to OS9 with VGA on another monitor and it came up fine.
I shut down and booted to OSX on DVI and it displayed fine.
I booted back to OS9 on DVI and noted that it would display to the point of the "Happy Mac" icon and then go blank.
I rebooted holding shift and got the same results with the "Happy Mac" and then it went blank.
I rebooted with Command-V and the results were also the same with the "Happy Mac" then it went blank. No text appeared.

Sounds like the machine always uses VGA for the primary monitor no matter if there's anything there or not (at least when booting Mac OS 9).
You probably have the happy Mac and the extensions loading on the VGA output when you have just a blank screen over DVI (what Mac OS 9 probably thinks is monitor 2).

I would get a DVI splitter (spilts DVI-I to VGA and DVI-D), connect two displays and set the DVI output monitor as the primary display when booted into Mac OS 9.
Hopefully it will stick and you always get output over DVI as primary after that. Another thing to try is "zapping" PRAM while having the DVI moitor connected. It should drop any notion of VGA ever being used before and just use the DVI-D output as the "primary".

Offline ELN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2019, 09:33:35 PM »
AdmiralBrannigan, will you please zip and post your /System/Library/Extensions/AppleNDRV folder? And what is your exact Mac OS X version?

Also, try the new ROM on the mini thread. Trash your Monitors and Display preference files for good measure.

Offline darthnVader

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2019, 05:12:00 AM »
Likely has something to do with the 'NDRV' we are using for OS 9.

Could also be running up on the 135Mhz pixel clock, but as it works with OS X, I assume what is going on is OS 9 is setting a refresh rate higher than 60Hz, maybe 1920x1200@72Hz.

http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,4337.0.html

Offline darthnVader

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2019, 05:41:57 AM »
One thing you could try is to delete the Display Preferences file from OS 9, boot into Open Firmware and see if you can set the correct mode:

Code: [Select]
dev screen
show-modes
set-mode x

Where x=valid mode from show-modes command.

Offline GaryN

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2019, 03:32:36 PM »
One thing you could try is to delete the Display Preferences file from OS 9, boot into Open Firmware and see if you can set the correct mode:

Code: [Select]
dev screen
show-modes
set-mode x

Where x=valid mode from show-modes command.

That's a good idea;or at least it would be if not for the second issue the good Admiral is having:

I booted to OS9 with VGA on another monitor and it came up fine.
I shut down and booted to OSX on DVI and it displayed fine.
I booted back to OS9 on DVI and noted that it would display to the point of the "Happy Mac" icon and then go blank.
I rebooted holding shift and got the same results with the "Happy Mac" and then it went blank.
I rebooted with Command-V and the results were also the same with the "Happy Mac" then it went blank. No text appeared.

The Mini (and this may also be ROM-related) is NOT recognizing the Aluminum kbd until the kbd extension is loaded so NO startup key commands work.
This is another one of those fun little known "mysteries" that pop up sometimes in Mac hardware - especially during transitions like PPC > Intel; MacOS > OSX etc.

It's a kind of thing that happens when you don't have the exact correct combination of hardware, software, firmware rev, ROM rev etc.
Figuring out exactly which lil' bit 'o code is the culprit however… ooh, some fun now!
It's probably ROM-related. It: A) Does NOT happen with all Aluminums; B) Happens with both OS9 and OSX.

I have exactly the same issue using an Aluminum kbd with my MDD. But I love my Aluminum, so…
I took the easy fix route and I just keep an older USB kbd handy to plug in if I really need to get to OF or clean a desktop or whatever.

Bottom line is you gotta get to the Monitor panel and/or prefs to reset them.
Since you can boot OS9 with VGA, I would try booting it up, finding and deleting the Monitor prefs file and rebooting with the DVI connected.
……with ALL digits crossed.

Offline darthnVader

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Re: Mac Mini G4 1.25 and Apple 24" Cinema Display
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2019, 05:05:25 PM »
/Applications/Utilities/Terminal.app

Code: [Select]
sudo nvram auto-boot?=false