Author Topic: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*  (Read 8492 times)

supernova777

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the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« on: October 15, 2014, 02:49:02 PM »
compare :



these cards are virtually identical with the exception of the pcb cut + the size of the firmware rom chip and the addonics "chip heatsink"
of course the left one, is mac bootable.. + supports SMART  both of which must be facilitated by code from the larger firmware chip

http://www.bergertom.net/Electronics/SIL-3124.html#2
this page provides a closer look at the chips

here is another similar card:
http://www.ioisata.com/products/Host-Adapter/sata2-pcix01.htm

these cards support port multiplication:
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 06:48:11 AM by chrisNova777 »

Offline Protools5LEGuy

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2014, 04:26:25 PM »
http://www.firmtek.com/seritek/seritek-2se4/spec/
Bootable, but OSX only, I guess.
I will report back if 2se4 works for storage uses on OS9. The page of the user that reported badly over it seem to have a conflict with the pci, I think.
Looking for MacOS 9.2.4

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2014, 04:34:48 PM »
yes but we will be looking into changing that possibly  8) it might work it might not.. as i showed u there are many different firmwares to try

mactron have u checked the chip on your 1eVE2+2? is it sil3112? or sil3124? or is it this other type? "Vitesse" (that i spoke of here: http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=825.msg3071#msg3071)


we have the firmware for the 1v4 family of cards - we just need to find a card powered by the same chip..  OR try to flash these above cards with the firmware from the seritek 1v4 family WHICH DOES SUPPORT OS9 BOOT and also supports 4 port card

the writing on the chip:
GD31244 SL786 intel 03

http://www.seekic.com/newstock/GD31244_SL786_,GD312444,GD313.html
datasheet?

is this just the same as a SIL3124 it even has those numbers in it.. and 4 ports like any other sil3124

here is the old thread:
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=825.msg3060#msg3060

we need to find a card powered by this chip:
http://www.digchip.com/data/514/514-616-0-VSC7174.pdf

Quote
The VSC7174 is a single chip PCI/PCI-X to
Serial ATA Host Bus Adapter that provides a
robust, high-performance interface to Serial
ATA Disk Drives, CD-ROMs, DVD-ROM's and
Tape facilities. The device supports 8b/10b
encoded data at Serial ATA v1.0 operating
speeds of 1.5 Gb/s - equivalent to 150 MB/s
of raw transfer performance; in addition, the VSC7174 can deliver
burst transfer rates of up to 1064 MB/s.
The VSC7174 is driver compatible with existing operating systems
supporting parallel ATA interfaces – providing an easy migration
path for existing IDE customers.
The ease-of-use, flexibility, superior performance, and attractive
price of the VSC7174 make it an ideal choice for your Serial ATA
Host controller needs.
Contact your local Vitesse sales representative for future Serial
ATA products.

whats so different about sil3124 is:
-its sata2 300mb/s
-supports port multiplier

while the other card is
-sata1 150mb/s
-no port multiplier
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 06:53:27 AM by chrisNova777 »

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2014, 04:47:20 PM »


this is the 100% confirmed mac os 9 compatbile + bootable version
http://www.firmtek.com/seritek/seritek-1ve4/

this is the card u should have bought PTLEguy
and this card uses the exact same chip as the card mactron has, the 1ve2+2 (also written as 1eVE2+2) also the 1v4, these 3 cards (1v4, 1ve4, 1ve2+2) are all in the same "family" and these are the absolute best cards for mac os 9!!!!!!!! these 3 models...

this is the card that perplexed me as it has no rom chip on the card
maybe this is why:

is the 128k serial flash EEPROM is built into the chip itself??? is that why this card has no PMC or MX flash rom chip on it??
or is the rom chip on the back of the card?

i cant remember where i got this info from... about the chip being the vitesse chip "vitesse vcs7174"
mactron did u tell this name to me? maybe i found a higher res pic

heres a higher res pic of the 1v4:

**** another similarity i see between these cards and the SIL3124, in common they both have these PLED 2 pin jumpers for connection to a hard drive light for monitoring disk activity, this is really cool because no other mac os 9 compatible hd interface has this i think?? but it also draws a line connecting these with other sil3124 cards... so.. is it possible to take the firmware for the 1v4 family of cards and use on a sil3124 card? has this been attempted by anyone? probably not!!!

heres the chip a bit closer up

u can see it says GD31244
this is the vitesse chip rebranded as "intel GD31244" i think

compare with the vsc 7174 image:



here u can see how the card is viewed in apple system profiler the model comes up as VSC__7174
(which stands for Vitesse VSC7174 sata chip)

this pic shows this card has the 5.1.1 firmware

pic showing the full length "Wide" pci 64bit card installed in a g4
the 2+2 card providing 2 internal ports + 2 external ports.. perfect! *THE BEST* card.. 100%
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 07:33:30 AM by chrisNova777 »

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2014, 05:36:25 PM »
....
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 06:57:32 AM by chrisNova777 »

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2014, 06:13:05 AM »
here is info on the pmc flash rom chip.. re: sizes of the chip
note that pm39LV010 is only 1Mbit, and PM39LV040 is 4Mbit, 4 times the size

lucky for us we can use google to convert Mbit size to KiloByte:

and the result:
pm39LV512 512Kbit = 62.5KByte
pm39LV010 1Mbit = 125KByte
pm39LV020 2Mbit = 250KByte
PM39LV040 4Mbit = 500KByte

compare with the size of the seritek firmwares:
http://macos9lives.com/downloads/public/seritek/

Quote
[ ]   SeriTek1S2_513.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    458K   
[ ]   SeriTek1SE2_513.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    493K   
[ ]   SeriTek1SM2_5.3.2.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    208K   
[ ]   SeriTek1V2E2_513.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    449K   
[ ]   SeriTek1V4_513.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    427K   
[ ]   SeriTek1VE4_513.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    451K   
[ ]   SeriTek2SE2_5.3.2.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    1.0M   
[ ]   SeriTek2SE4_5.3.2.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    624K   
[ ]   SeriTek2SM2_5.3.2.zip    2014-03-22 08:17    502K   
and those sizes are zipped.. but i think they also contain 'installation app' so the size isnt the real size of the firmware file

looking inside the 1v4 firmware zip..
i see the file: ROMFILE.7174 which is 127KB
the exact size that this vitesse vsc 7174 documentation says the eeprom is, 128KB.

and looking inside the 1s2 firmware zip.
i see the file: ROMFILE.1S2
the size: 139KB

the reason we cant take this 1s2 firmware and flash to generic sil3112A card.. the rom chip is too small to hold this data.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 09:27:59 AM by chrisNova777 »

Offline MacTron

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2014, 07:26:10 AM »

is the 128k serial flash EEPROM is built into the chip itself??? is that why this card has no PMC or MX flash rom chip on it??
or is the rom chip on the back of the card?

There is a small smd chip that can be a EPROM...
It's really small. I'll try to read or made a picture of it from my SeriTek 1VE2+2 ...

Quote
i cant remember where i got this info from... about the chip being the vitesse chip "vitesse vcs7174"
mactron did u tell this name to me? maybe i found a higher res pic

I don't remember...

Quote
pic showing the full length "Wide" pci 64bit card installed in a g4
the 2+2 card providing 2 internal ports + 2 external ports.. perfect! *THE BEST* card.. 100%

Totally agree.
Please don't PM about things that are not private.

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2014, 07:52:37 AM »
comparing here u see the only ones of "sata_vsc" types are vitesse + intel

so i think there must be an actual "intel" brand card called the Intel 31244 Serial ATA
that is the same as the seritek 1v4 family of cards

or perhaps it is vitesse which uses intels chip??
they look identical i dont know which is which.. if intel took from vitesse or vitesse from intel

http://www.electronicproducts.com/Semiconductors/Applications/Intel_31244_PCI-X_to_Serial_ATA_Controller.aspx

see here is a guy who has posted saying he has a card of this name
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/intel-31244-pci-x-to-serial-ata-pv-745n.19455/
Quote
I am using a dell powervault 745N, with the 4 port SATA controller module (Intel 31244 PCI-X to Serial ATA). This is not the same as the on-board 2 port SATA controller.

anyways, keep an eye out for this !
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 08:06:26 AM by chrisNova777 »

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2014, 08:47:04 AM »

There is a small smd chip that can be a EPROM...
It's really small. I'll try to read or made a picture of it from my SeriTek 1VE2+2 ...


Please don't PM about things that are not private.

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2014, 09:28:32 AM »
can u look up this ATMEL chip to see if its 128KB eeprom? i cant read the picture its not big enough LOL need a magnifying glass ;D
http://www.atmel.com/products/memories/serial/i2c.aspx

AT24C128C 128Kb I²C-compatible 2-wire Serial EEPROM
http://www.atmel.com/devices/AT24C128C.aspx
http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc8734.pdf

definately looks like they make 128KB

strange that the 1S2 has a bigger rom firmware then the 1V4 family cards...

Offline MacTron

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2014, 02:41:22 PM »
can u look up this ATMEL chip to see if its 128KB eeprom? i cant read the picture its not big enough LOL need a magnifying glass ;D

I can hardly read it. It seems to be ATMEL 552 25F 1024... ...
Please don't PM about things that are not private.

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2014, 02:44:33 PM »
can u look up this ATMEL chip to see if its 128KB eeprom? i cant read the picture its not big enough LOL need a magnifying glass ;D

I can hardly read it. It seems to be ATMEL 552 25F 1024... ...

according to google, 1024 Kilobit = 128KBytes so that is the perfect size to hold this seritek 1v4 ROMFILE.7174 firmware file


i wonder if they purposely made this firmware slightly too big to fit on a 1MBit chip (125KB) (the rom chips ending in 010)
its just 3KB too big to try to burn onto a card with the chip below;
i wonder if this rom could be reduced by 3KB somehow
125KB

if we could find someone to reduce this rom
we could have endless supply of bootable cards i think these generic sil3112 cards all feature the 010 125KB rom chip - ** max do u know if they come with the 512 chip? or the 010 chip?
another obstacle is that there is also some type of protection code check in the programming of the firmware file aswell
which checks the manufacturer of the flash rom + its size... but if this code could be removed somehow maybe it would equal the extra 3KB!! LOL
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 02:57:56 PM by chrisNova777 »

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2014, 03:15:13 PM »

heres a better shot of the chip on mactrons card

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2014, 09:12:22 PM »
even inside the 1v4 firmware it says its compatible with the intel 31244


http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/52338-intel-intros-serial-ata2-controller

found this article tallking about the introduction of the intel controller "31244" which is supposedly a clone/compatible with the VSC 7174 drivers

Quote

   
Quote
Intel Corp. introduced a Serial ATA-2 controller today for high-end storage systems, the first time the chip giant has brought the technology to market.

    Intel’s four-port Serial ATA Controller 31244 can transfer 1.5 Gbits/s on each of its four ports and can be paired with the Intel IOP321 I/O processor for RAID on the motherboard applications.

    In this case, the term “Serial ATA-2″ is a bit of a misnomer. The 100 members of the Serial ATA Working Group, including Intel, Dell, Seagate, and other vendors, decided to first tack on networking and high-end storage features to the existing Serial ATA standard, which was completed this past August. These products, which include the Intel 31244, are expected to begin rolling out during the first quarter of 2003.

    In the second half of 2003, members are expected to define a higher signalling rate for Serial ATA-2 for product delivery in 2004; 300-Mbytes/s has been suggested as a likely target. Serial ATA products transfer data at 150 Mbytes/s.

    Intel’s new controller features support for PCI-X-based communications applications, including increased voltage to interoperate with backplanes, technology that facilitates visual monitoring, and planned support for command queuing, which improves performance in multi-user applications for NAS and RAID systems.

    Intel also introduced an iSCSI adapter an a 400-MHz ultra-low-voltage embedded Celeron for storage applications.


http://www.networkworld.com/article/2342984/data-center/intel-expands-storage-component-offering.html
Quote

 
Quote
  Intel expanded its line of components for storage products on Monday, announcing a serial ATA controller, an iSCSI storage adapter and a low-voltage Celeron processor.

    The new Intel 31244 serial ATA controller can transfer data at 1.5G bit/sec on each of its four ports. The controller, which links a system's motherboard with a hard disk drive, improves performance in network-attached storage devices and RAID systems, according to an Intel statement.

    The Intel PRO/1000 T IP iSCSI adapter is meant for storage-area networks (SAN). The adapter uses Intel's Xscale processor technology to take over IP and iSCSI tasks from the host processor, which increases throughput in SANs, according to Intel.
    MORE ON NETWORK WORLD: 13 awesome and scary things in near Earth space

    Intel also announced a version of its Celeron processor that does not need extensive cooling and can thus be fitted in small storage devices. The 400 MHz ultralow voltage (ULV) Celeron processor dissipates 4.1 watts of heat, Intel said.

    Available in the first quarter of 2003, the 31244 serial ATA controller will cost $22 in 10,000-unit quantities and the iSCSI $695 in single units. The ULV Celeron processor at 400 MHz is now available for $38 when bought in quantities of 1,000, Intel said.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 09:23:04 PM by chrisNova777 »

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2014, 03:56:33 PM »
oops wrong thread ;D

supernova777

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2014, 10:24:41 PM »
another card... the tempo-X
sticker on chip says marvell but chip looks the same? as the vitesse chip?

macStuff

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2019, 04:05:54 PM »
http://www.firmtek.com/seritek/seritek-2se4/spec/
Bootable, but OSX only, I guess.
I will report back if 2se4 works for storage uses on OS9. The page of the user that reported badly over it seem to have a conflict with the pci, I think.

can we get an answer on this?

Offline Protools5LEGuy

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2019, 05:25:25 PM »
@seritek 2se4
Quote
Mac OS X version 10.4.0 or later (works best with 10.4.6 or later)

It works on Panther too.
Looking for MacOS 9.2.4

macStuff

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2019, 11:26:21 PM »
Does it work in os9? at all? as a data drive? or not at all? completely invisible??

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2019, 12:05:07 PM »
Oelmuvun said;
Sil3124 (found on SeriTek2SE4)
Mac OS X only, I cannot remember more about it off the top of my head. I might say it is the least interesting aside from it supporting 4 ports. PCI-X


Chris I have this card in a QS 867mhz it only works in macosx. Supports sataII
It has a Sil3124ACBHU chip check photos.
If it can be flashed to work in macos9 I would be very happy.
Looking for MacOS 9.2.4

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2019, 11:22:20 AM »
Does it work in os9? at all? as a data drive? or not at all? completely invisible??

Nope, there is no SIM inside of the 3124 card. I don't remember I ever did it, just started to write.
Verified yesterday - nothing for sure. It was confusing because I remember to spend the entire summer in the home of my parents to make the Open Firmware driver for 3132 and 3124.
And usually if there is an OF driver than I tend to write the SIM as well. But I did not write it, the project was kind of lower priority because the Marvell chip is much better.

Remember: it was around 2005 when port multipliers and PCIe based G5 looked hot. The performance of 3132 sux horribly, so does 3124 for a different reason (PMP handling bug).
Unfortunately I screwed up something with Marvell 7042 and did not unscrew it until I got some help from them, but that was maybe around 2009 or so.

That was really a seniority moment. :(


macStuff

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2020, 07:48:51 AM »
pcie g5 - i wish they never made this machine tbh; just made things complicated

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2020, 08:46:50 PM »
pcie g5 - i wish they never made this machine tbh; just made things complicated

Not that bad. I rather wish they would make some follow-up of that.
The machines which make the life really complicated are the first generation Intel-based Macs, including the two first generations of Mac Pro.

That really sux because (officially) you are limited to 32-bit OS and 32-bit EFI. For some degree there is a remedy for the OS limitation (make a Hackintosh out of your Macintosh - and it's not even against EULA), but not for 32-bit EFI.


By far the most evil Macs are the ones with the T2 chip. Besides of obvious architecture problems the T2 chip has own NVMe controller which shouldn't be called "NVMe" as it has very little to do with the NVMe spec.

Imagine what happens when Apple abandons these machines (and these machines are running their own micro-OS inside of the T2, nothing is documented!).

Than you want to install Linux or FreeBSD on the T2 Macs.
Is there any open source driver for the T2 NVMe?


I think, the only feasible way is to reverse-engineer their T2 drivers.
But the legal questions will arise.

IMO the best would be if the government policy would prevent such closed deals.
After all, any OS is much like airport, train station / train tracks, Cable, Interstate / Autobahn: it's for people to access the infrastructure.
There should be clear guidelines what a manufacturer of infrastructure should be allowed and what should not.

IMO, the "T2" chip crosses that line.

Same with major busses like AHCI (versus ATA / first-gen SATA), the entire USB stack, the entire Thunderbolt stack not only being closed source - but guarded by an army of Cerberi.

Do you know that NOTHING, really NOTHING prevents a Thunderbolt-3 based PCIe card work in a G5 with PCIe slots?
These "magical" "head wires" are just a huge pile of bovine excrement.

Just read this:

https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/production-expert-1/2019/3/15/mac-pro-51-cheese-grater-with-thunderbolt-the-impossible-is-now-possible

Why a THB-3 card "does not work" (and not even showing up) in any Mac Pro?
To my understanding just because the card needs an EFI driver to enable some power coming in.

The alternate solution is to boot Windows first via Bootcamp, Windows has the run-time THB-3 driver, that enables the power.
Re-start the Mac in macOS mode - and you have the THB-3 ports on that 2009 Mac Pro.

Such thing (because THB-3 is obviously a part of the OS infrastructure) should be illegal and even criminal.

Of course, a third party "slave" device (THB-3 drive or monitor) can have a choice, support a certain machine / configuration or not.
But the machine itself should not do the same in reverse!

In other words: you drive down an Autobahn. You come across the border with Austria. It's your choice to drive into Austria or not.
But as long as you pay the (reasonable) money for using the road, Austria won't refuse to let you in.

Or: you want to travel from Warsaw to Verona. You have a host of choices by rail - but no matter how Italian Railway did try hard (and they did!) to prevent third-party rail access: you still can travel. Because at one point such restriction would bump into legislation and into the law. But of course you are not obligated to travel to Verona. You may want to travel to Prague, it's entirely your choice (and not the choice of Italian Rail or Czech Rail companies!)


macStuff

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Re: the quest for (cheap) 64bit sata *os9 bootable*
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2020, 11:52:24 PM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gChOifUJZMc" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gChOifUJZMc</a>