Author Topic: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?  (Read 741 times)

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« on: March 19, 2019, 10:47:19 AM »
So I was interested in being able to send sds messages to samplers and such via MIDI..   i use a program on my OSX machine called C6.app that is a very nice simple Sysex program. 

I'm also looking at programs like Unisyn but I am not sure I've found a version for Mac. 

I wish Sample Wrench was for mac because my REAL dream would be to be able to send / receive samples from my Akai S612, but sample wrench is the only program I know that will work with it

My friend has windows and can send actual wavs directly to/from his S612 using sample wrench.  I wanna be cool too.. :)

Thanks,
Caleb

Offline refinery

  • Consistant Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2019, 02:27:58 PM »
i dont know about sysex but D-Sound Pro will do SDS transfers.

http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=4107.0
G4/MDD 1.42 (9), G4/GB 500DP (X), Beige G3 400 (upgraded) (9), PBG4Ti 1Ghz (X), PBG3WS 300 (9)

got my mind on my scsi and my scsi on my mind

Offline Astroman

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 195
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2019, 04:01:04 AM »
... I wish Sample Wrench was for mac because my REAL dream would be to be able to send / receive samples from my Akai S612, but sample wrench is the only program I know that will work with it

My friend has windows and can send actual wavs directly to/from his S612 using sample wrench.  I wanna be cool too.. :)
It will (probably) not play the sounds, but early (Connectix) versions of SoftPC were really smart Windoze replacements. In a Mac only environment we used it for years to run a Win only communication software for an IBM AS400 logistic system... on a 68K Mac LC475  ;D
Once Microsoft aquired the system it went down the drain, so stick with the original.
Maybe SampleWrench accepts the environment, too.
The nice feature of SoftPC is that it doesn't need to boot - you can quit and reload the state of the system at arbitrary times. It definitely was the better Windoze...

ps: Have you tried Bias Peak with the S612 ? Bias has SDS Midi in it's Sampler menu. It would be my preferred sample editor anyway.
(Iirc one could access files from the Mac drive in SoftPC)


Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2019, 06:04:27 AM »
well i'm not too concerned about it playing sounds.  however i do need to touch the MOTU midi hardware to send / receive midi dumps from the device..  seems like hardware back then and how software spoke to it was a lot less universal and it seems like software had to be written to support specific pieces of hardware as there was no (i may be wrong) generic midi API for OS9..  something that everyone used.

MOTU for example has freemidi which is their own product to communicate with software and the MidiExpress and other usb and / or serial devices.   

A product like this would seem like one more layer of abstraction from the midi hardware.  It may even "run" but simply not know how to talk to the hardware. I'll have to look into that still potentially. 

That product reminds me of wine for Linux. 

Offline Astroman

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 195
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2019, 03:24:31 PM »
No, it's a completely different story - SoftPC is a true hardware emulator and fakes a PC so detailed that you have to remind yourself to the fact that you cannot install drivers for hardware that doesn't exist.
Which is likely the case if you need a special interface like the Motu, as you mention.
One has to get along with what's implemented and iirc that was ethernet and (probably) serial ports.

Wine on the other hand runs great in OSX. I used the 'lazy man's version' Crossover for years as a runtime environment for a custom built Windoze application.
Even my developement system (which was not Visual Studio) worked flawless, except for the basic GDI function that automatically interpolates scaled images. It scaled but forgot to interpolate.




Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2019, 03:30:16 PM »
Cool I think my best hope is to find D-Sound Pro..   I need something that supports Akai samplers as the early ones required programs to use drivers to talk..  the pre 16bit sampler units can't just dump 16bit data into 12bit sample space..  takes some conversion. 

Caleb

Offline macarone

  • Active Member
  • **
  • Posts: 21
  • New Member
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2019, 02:54:37 PM »
I suspect this may not be what you are looking for, since I found it so easily, but I'm attaching it anyway, since it's so small.

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2019, 03:26:54 PM »
sweet where did you find it?  the links i found were all dead or asked for a ftp login.

Thanks!
Caleb

Offline Syntho

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2019, 09:37:25 PM »
What is SDS? A way to transfer samples over midi? What speed do you get with that? I hear it's incredibly slow. I use SCSI hard drives for doing that, but I imagine a sample or two every once in a while would be ok for it.

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2019, 05:10:52 AM »
that's exactly what it is.  and yes it's very slow.. i believe i had it worked out to 1kps..  some patches i've moved over have taken as long as 30-40min.. but drum kits and such can be very quick like.. 1-2min.. 

This might seem terrible, but it's a digital transfer which I believe makes it worth it because i could sample it through analog methods but this creates more work to edit / trim the sample in your sampler and then possible noise / hum introduced..

the point of this is that i don't have scsi for my 2013 i7 imac.. they don't make it unless i want to try and buy some $150-200 scsi usb adapter which might still not actually work with the software old enough to support scsi.. 

so i just get it done using sds with C6.app which is amazing. 


Also regarding SCSI I'm using it a lot with my Peavey SP Sampler.  I have a SCSI x4 CD Rom to load peavey and akai sample cd-roms..  and I own two external SCSI SD to Micro SD cards in 1990's HD enclosures each giving me 4gb drives plus I have zip drives hooked up to both (to transport patches between the two peavey samplers I have setup.    I keep one upstairs in my office to do peavey patch editing / creation where I can hang out while doing other stuff.. and then take those new patches and add them to the 2nd scsi hd downstairs


However that's how i do it upstairs on my i7 iMac.  but my G4 sawtooth in my studio is what's physically connected to my Akai S612 so I need something that works directly with that hardware from OS9 apps.  I could probably make sample wrench work as I was able to get my Peavey SP Sample editor for windows run in Paralleles (VM) under XP through my iMac and talk to my peavey sampler and worked fairly well..  the only grips i had were with the softwares actual design, not the communication between the sampler and computer. 


Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2019, 09:26:02 AM »
also I did try to install that program but didn't have luck with ti..  but i'm maybe doing something wrong.  the zip file didn't seem to contain an executable that OS9 understood what to do with it.  Has anyone else tried to install that d-sound file shared above? 

Offline IIO

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2106
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2019, 03:46:26 PM »
try peak. but i  am not so sure about akais older than S-950.
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline refinery

  • Consistant Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2019, 04:00:17 PM »
let me see if i can wrap up my copy of it and post it somewhere tonight.
G4/MDD 1.42 (9), G4/GB 500DP (X), Beige G3 400 (upgraded) (9), PBG4Ti 1Ghz (X), PBG3WS 300 (9)

got my mind on my scsi and my scsi on my mind

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2019, 04:58:33 PM »
that would be awesome.  thank you!   yea i'm hoping if peak at least supports SDS sample transfer i could use my Peavey SP samplers with my Mac.  I can use O6 a OSX app but keepin' it pure in the studio. 

Offline Syntho

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2019, 05:42:03 PM »
Try this.

Offline Syntho

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2019, 05:45:35 PM »
Also, it sounds convenient to do sample dumps over midi, but simply putting the samples on a floppy disk and putting it into my sampler seems faster and easier. I'm not sure if with a sample dump that it would carry over the file name and everything too. Maybe if I used a sampler where importing wav/aif files wasn't possible, then I'd probably use it.

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2019, 08:10:20 PM »
wear and tear.. it's not about speed but rather preserving the hardware.  Also my peavey sp uses a special format so i can't really use floppy disks to move from pc/mac to peavey..  file dump doesn't keep file names, but as long as the file order is preserved (it is) when I push a series of samples it doesn't matter.. they are just slot ids..  C0 C1 C2.. for example.. just are in 0 1 2 slots on the sampler..

As for the S612, the quik disks (which I have) are great, but they are not even digital and they are over 35 years old.. those belts will inevitably break..  so yea using SDS reduces wear on anything.   Unfortunately the S612 and other earlier Akais did have "drivers" and not use a universal (SDS) standard for data dumps.. 

Sample wrench is the only program I know first hand that will work.. but that's windows / amiga only..  i have the amiga version but my amiga isn't configured to send dumps through my MOTU gear.. just too much trouble.. for now i'm still using Quik disks sparingly..  but worst cast i may just have to bring a small xp laptop into the picture, but i'd like to just get it right from OS9 through my MOTU hardware.. straight into the S612 and from it. 

Digital Performer supports S612..  i need to check and see if Unisyn 1.5 supports the S612..

Offline Syntho

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2019, 09:31:46 AM »
Did you try what I posted above? Is that copy working? It's loading for me. Maybe I'll try doing a test sample dump to see how fast this works. May come in handy someday...

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2019, 10:31:51 AM »
I didn't get to try out the d-sound software last night like I had hoped..  but i'm going to this weekend.  I'm hoping d-sound has early akai support.. its pretty old so I'm optimistic. 

Much like how MOTU's Freemidi recognizes the S612 as a sampler it has preloaded..  when units are recognized out of the box, it probably means they have been incorporated, but we'll see.  Even if I could just do SDS with my Peaveys, would still be cool..  I'd love to be able to SDS OUT of the Peavey.  I've not been able to get that to work so far.. but i didn't try to hard.. with over 400 custom and professional peavey SP patches.  It's tough to jump to other samplers ..

I have an Akai S2000 that i got recently with EB16 and 8 out expansion.. but looking at the empty SCSI 700mb HD..  and no paper manual in front of me..  its like.. "sigh.. do i really want to do this?"  heh

Caleb

Offline IIO

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2106
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2019, 04:48:32 AM »
regarding peak; i guess i keep mixing up SCSI and MIDI sample transfer. havent used either one, because i stopped using 90ies samplers when the 90ies were over :)
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #20 on: April 13, 2019, 04:54:46 AM »
well what are you doing here then with that mindset? lol..   you could just as easily be slighted by saying OS9 is dead and obsolete.. heh. 

Offline IIO

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2106
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2019, 09:04:01 PM »
well, mac os 8 kind of replaced my akai s-950 and s-1000, and mac os 9 (almost) replaced my emulator 4. why would anyone use a 16 bit sampler when oyu can have float in mac or windows? :)
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2019, 09:19:51 PM »
just sonic differences.. filters.. effects..  and sometimes its just nice to have things outside of the computer..   not saying that software samplers are bad..   just a different feel.   i'm a big peavey dpm sp fan.. 

kind of an underdog / unknown early 90's sampler..   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVPm9ii3CQE   a tour of it I made awhile back.   I also have an SP+  which has 64mb support and 32 voice + some effects.  but fortunately patches made on either are cross compatible (other than things like memory / voices)..   

Caleb

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2019, 09:23:59 PM »
a few other videos i made of some custom things i made.. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4QuzHZPdM0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVQwlvIAh7g

Offline Jakl

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 319
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2019, 01:45:40 AM »
Not sure if anyone has mentioned but try Recycle 1.7 I'm sure
you can try to add a sampler and see if it works - for SDS
transfers.

Heres the download link.

http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php/topic,1086.0.html

« Last Edit: April 15, 2019, 04:45:51 AM by Jakl »

Offline ovalking

  • Consistant Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2019, 01:03:40 PM »
Try this.

That one works thanks. The earlier one claims to be an smi but it does not mount.

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2019, 01:36:47 PM »
yes D-Sound worked for me, but i'm facing a noobish problem with old school midi stuff on OS9..

I have a MOTU MTP-AV and a MIDI Express (both USB)..  so yea I have 16 midi ins and 16 midi outs.. 

these old programs don't seem to have a way to interface with my hardware.  Does anyone know if there is a way to get midi info to a particular device on a particular midi in / out with this kind of hardware?

If not, how are people connecting midi gear to their OS9 macs these days? 


Offline Syntho

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2019, 02:16:34 PM »
I don't use Macs with USB on them  -afro-

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2019, 07:04:49 PM »
gotcha, well i have a MOTU MTP AV that's serial.. but i got it so i could network with my USB one..  which game me the redonkulous total of 24 MIDI IN/OUT.. which at one point i was actually using all of the outs..  but at that point i realized..  jesus i have too much stuff.. and sold off a lot.. heh. 

unfortunately none of my Macs have serial.. I sold my Mac Classic awhile back.


Offline IIO

  • Platinum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2106
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #29 on: April 16, 2019, 08:17:43 PM »
this question comes up from time to time and if i am not wrong, the "midimanager" OMS driver should be able to anything which the midimanager extension did before.
if a program does not support midimanager but only somehow "directly" talks to the serial interface, you are probably lost.
"It is true that the "pre-emptive multitasking" advantage present in OS X can be illustrated by downloading CD-ROM ISOs and rendering chaos theory formulas while simultaneously instant messaging and posting on FaceBook what you ate... but in reality, what did you create?"
- DieHard, random forum troll at macos9lives.com

Offline part12studios

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 164
  • new to the forums
Re: Anyone know a good Sysex / SDS program for OS9?
« Reply #30 on: April 17, 2019, 05:15:29 AM »
yea that's what i suspect. but yea i need to explore those programs closer..  i have a peavey sp editor that also is pretty old (early 90's) will run but it also seems to have a simplistic midi menu. 

like i'm not seeing ways to choose a particular midi in / out..   it's just simplistic stuff like midi channel and maybe device ID for sysex..  but maybe there is another way to expose more options. 

I'm looking to see if i can get unisyn to install in DP3.. as i understand it, it can incorporate into DP3 which would be ideal as of course it's MOTU and of that generation..  not to mention I own a bunch of gear that software actually recognizes out of the box..  even (crossing fingers) the Akai S612!