Any one want to help build a community made OS 9.3?

[GaryN]

  You'd think it would have really put a dent in Sonnet's MP product sales if they'd never gotten it to work in all the other AGP machines except for the MDD.

Not at all sure what you're talking about. I'm saying the MP file that works with the MDX was written specifically for the MDX. As I recall, finding that was no easy task. I'm thinking there may be others for the DP upgrades Sonnet made for the QS and AGP that are still in the haystack somewhere.

[MacOS Plus]

  You'd think it would have really put a dent in Sonnet's MP product sales if they'd never gotten it to work in all the other AGP machines except for the MDD.

Not at all sure what you're talking about. I'm saying the MP file that works with the MDX was written specifically for the MDX. As I recall, finding that was no easy task. I'm thinking there may be others for the DP upgrades Sonnet made for the QS and AGP that are still in the haystack somewhere.

  As you say, there must have been a file available to deal with the non-MDX systems, whether the file came from Sonnet or some other 3rd party.  That's exactly why I was wondering how MacTron was having trouble, since he said he'd tried "everything".  Given how much older a file version the hacked one I downloaded is versus the later stock Apple-supplied one in the 9.2.2 image, I am rather surprised it wouldn't work universally.  This seemed to suggest to me that this hacked file may have actually pre-dated the release of the Sonnet MDX CPUs.

  I'm really hoping that someone with more in-depth knowledge than I can delve into the various MP support files and sort this out.  At this point it's just guessing because I don't have the skill to properly probe these files for differences or to actually document the code structure or instructions present.

[MacOS Plus]

  Quick update - As promised I hooked up my Quicksilver, previously only running OSX, and I tried to boot it using the 9.2.2 drive I was already booting my MDD and FW800 machines with.  The upgrade processor in this system is a Giga Designs 7447a dual 1.8GHZ G4.  The substitute multiprocessing file that worked with the Sonnet MDX on the other machines froze the QS - no big surprise.  (Removing it booted the system as single 1.8GHZ processor - super-speedy still!)  The Giga Designs software under OSX has to be run first to separately enable OS9 booting capability via some sort of PRAM alteration (in addition to originally having to alter the firmware and nvram to boot OSX at all in the first place before installing the upgrade).

  The Sonnet installer itself is supposed to patch the Apple CPU Plugins file, however due to the large number of revisions of the file by Apple the process often fails without any indication, presumably because it doesn't find anything it recognizes how to patch.  Sonnet was supposed to have been emailing a patched file on request.  I am going to send them a message and see if they can still do this.

  I'm not done researching the issue yet.  I'll post my findings later.  One thing though that potentially affects the Sawtooth systems is that one revision of the motherboard is completely incompatible with multi-processor CPU modules.  This is documented in the appropriate support section on the Sonnet website.  (The direct link to the PDF file in question is http://www.sonnettech.com/support/downloads/manuals/sg4d_2g_addendum.pdf.  I'm going to check both of my Sawtooth boards to see if they are of the offending revision before I waste my time on an automatic dead end.

[nanopico]

ROM File only
http://ww.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

@nanopico: the download link is not available.
can you please re-upload this file? I wish to perform some test with it ...

Isn't funny how you miss one little w and the link doesn't work?
http://www.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

[MacTron]

Isn't funny how you miss one little w and the link doesn't work?
http://www.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

Thank You.
I should realize about that ... 

[MacTron]

The Multi processors software is originated at Daystar for the Genesis MP Mac compatible computer ( equipped dual CPU 604e series ) later acquired by Apple.
And this software was integrated in to Mac Os. Its purpose was not only providing Multi CPU support for applications, but Deep Sleep and CPU power saving features.
The power saving features, while very important, are the responsible of a lot of peripherals failures, and -in my opinion- the startup crash if a 7447 or 7448 CPU is installed .
So we may have  a temporary fix  if we can somehow disable the CPU sleep without disabling the dual CPU support ...
The "Sonnet" fix is only working on MDX systems, so I have no idea about what they did to make it work.But it is possible that Sonnet disable the CPU Plugins somehow, while its own extension take care of the double 7447 CPU and/or the Sleep task.

[GaryN]

FWIW…My MDD will now crash if I try to sleep it since I installed the Sonnet MDX.

[IIO]

Isn't funny how you miss one little w and the link doesn't work?

i thought that was intended ... as a little intelligence filter ... to protect noobs from downloading modded ROM files?

[MacOS Plus]

FWIW…My MDD will now crash if I try to sleep it since I installed the Sonnet MDX.

  Well, at least we're having a consistent experience!  Perhaps we need to try this program:

"Sleeper"
http://download.cnet.com/Sleeper/3000-2094_4-10003462.html

  If anyone has experience with this software, please post.

[nanopico]

Isn't funny how you miss one little w and the link doesn't work?
http://www.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

Thank You.
I should realize about that ... 

Yeah but I also shouldn't post files as I'm falling asleep.

[GaryN]

Well, at least we're having a consistent experience!  Perhaps we need to try this program:

"Sleeper"
http://download.cnet.com/Sleeper/3000-2094_4-10003462.html
If anyone has experience with this software, please post.

Cool. I'll try it and report back.

[MacOS Plus]

Well, at least we're having a consistent experience!  Perhaps we need to try this program:

"Sleeper"
http://download.cnet.com/Sleeper/3000-2094_4-10003462.html
If anyone has experience with this software, please post.

Cool. I'll try it and report back.

  I'm very interested to know if this helps anything with our issue, and also if it's just a generally useful tool, mainly so I know if I should try to pursue paying for the software license after the trial expires.  The company website still exists but they don't themselves seem to directly mention this older software any longer.

  I've determined that my main Sawtooth is a usable revision for multiprocessing.  I've also determined that the Sawtooth I had in storage isn't working right and will need a lot of troubleshooting.  In addition, while digging around through my parts hoard I realized I have a Gigabit Ethernet motherboard which never had a case to call home.  If I get an adapter made up I should be able to power that one off a spare B&W power supply.

  Not that I expect either of these candidates to be any more likely to work dual in OS9 with the Giga Designs CPU I have, but the experiment would still be interesting.  I've sent off a message to Sonnet to see if anyone there still knows anything about the issue.  If I can find a reasonably-priced Sonnet Encore/ST Duet 1.8GHz I may very well buy it just so I have something extra to play with.

[MacTron]

And as promised (though a little later than mentioned)

I have tested this and have not had issues.  But having said that, I am not responsible if it does anything bad to your machine so test with caution.

I've modified it in a way that makes it generic.
It checks for a G4 and if present then checks the cpu version and modifies it if necessary.
This means it will boot on G3's and G4's that were already supported without modifying anything.

If it is not working I would appreciate the details of the machine it doesn't work on.

ROM File only
http://ww.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

This new "automatic" ROM, startup an unsupported eMac 1.25, without Open Firmware CPU hack!!.  (now I having troubles with the eMac 1.25 video hack ...)
But the 7448 upgraded Sawtooth, nor chime, without Open Firmware CPU hacks, I'll investigate it further.

[MacTron]

Well, at least we're having a consistent experience!  Perhaps we need to try this program:

"Sleeper"
http://download.cnet.com/Sleeper/3000-2094_4-10003462.html
If anyone has experience with this software, please post.

Cool. I'll try it and report back.

I have used "Sleeper" for a long time in some Macs. It works great. But it can't put a CPU into to sleep without the official support.

[nanopico]

And as promised (though a little later than mentioned)

I have tested this and have not had issues.  But having said that, I am not responsible if it does anything bad to your machine so test with caution.

I've modified it in a way that makes it generic.
It checks for a G4 and if present then checks the cpu version and modifies it if necessary.
This means it will boot on G3's and G4's that were already supported without modifying anything.

If it is not working I would appreciate the details of the machine it doesn't work on.

ROM File only
http://ww.gnerder.com/files/rom.sit

This new "automatic" ROM, startup an unsupported eMac 1.25, without Open Firmware CPU hack!!.  (now I having troubles with the eMac 1.25 video hack ...)
But the 7448 upgraded Sawtooth, nor chime, without Open Firmware CPU hacks, I'll investigate it further.

Well this is good to hear. So part way there.

[nanopico]

But the 7448 upgraded Sawtooth, nor chime, without Open Firmware CPU hacks, I'll investigate it further.

The list of PVR's I was working off of to detect and adjust did not include a 7448.  Can you get as far as loading open firmware? If you can, can you you check the CPU Version property of the CPU and let me know what it is?

[MacTron]

But the 7448 upgraded Sawtooth, nor chime, without Open Firmware CPU hacks, I'll investigate it further.

The list of PVR's I was working off of to detect and adjust did not include a 7448.  Can you get as far as loading open firmware? If you can, can you you check the CPU Version property of the CPU and let me know what it is?

No, I can't. The computer can't start. It don't make the startup chime. 

The eMac PVR is 80030101 ( PowerPC 7457A_v1.1)

[nanopico]

But the 7448 upgraded Sawtooth, nor chime, without Open Firmware CPU hacks, I'll investigate it further.

The list of PVR's I was working off of to detect and adjust did not include a 7448.  Can you get as far as loading open firmware? If you can, can you you check the CPU Version property of the CPU and let me know what it is?

No, I can't. The computer can't start. It don't make the startup chime. 

The eMac PVR is 80030101 ( PowerPC 7457A_v1.1)

Found it.  The 7448 is cpu version 80040101
For the rom I made I check if the version is higher than 80020102 and then set it to 80020102.
The so the ROM should work with the 7448
So if you you get no chime the ROM hasn't even loaded yet and from what I have read the nvram scripts don't run until after the chime. 

Maybe you need to pull the graphics card while it's on and plug it back in. (seriously though not recommended)

[MacOS Plus]

MacTron, you don't have any later model you could test that CPU in, do you?  If your Sawtooth won't even chime with the Sonnet installed I don't think it's likely ever going to work in that particular motherboard.  At least testing on another motherboard would help with 'proof of concept'.  This is why I'm keen on getting the spare Gigabit Ethernet motherboard I have working, plus it gives me a lot more options for video cards since it has an ADC-compliant AGP slot, which the Sawtooth doesn't.  Did you check the UNI-North revision of your board as per Sonnet's instructions?  I at least now know that my one Sawtooth has a suitable UNI-North should I choose to test on it.

Very interesting stuff with those PVR values.  It looks like we're getting much closer to eliminating the initial snag of at least getting as far as video on most machines.  It would be really nice to put all that NVRAM nonsense behind us because it will open up testing to a lot more users and therefore a wider range of hardware.  Then it's mostly just down to dealing with the specifics of certain hardware sub-components in each machine.

On a partly related note I just had a thought - for devices like internal USB bluetooth that are throwing up "no driver" messages, if there's no hope of writing a functional driver could we at least make a 'dummy' driver so the message doesn't come up every boot?

[MacTron]

MacTron, you don't have any later model you could test that CPU in, do you?  If your Sawtooth won't even chime with the Sonnet installed I don't think it's likely ever going to work in that particular motherboard.  At least testing on another motherboard would help with 'proof of concept'.  This is why I'm keen on getting the spare Gigabit Ethernet motherboard I have working, plus it gives me a lot more options for video cards since it has an ADC-compliant AGP slot, which the Sawtooth doesn't.  Did you check the UNI-North revision of your board as per Sonnet's instructions?  I at least now know that my one Sawtooth has a suitable UNI-North should I choose to test on it.

Maybe here we have a misunderstanding. I know my english is awful.
The 7448 upgraded Sawtooth was working until I tried the nano pico "automatic" ROM, previously disabling all the Open Firmware patches.
Once I'll re-patch the system, I will check the 7448 PVR.